What with the ongoing arguments (I won’t even call them “debates”) about masking, I thought it would be interesting to try and give the arguments for masking a fair presentation, along with my reasons for remaining unconvinced. Note: this isn’t about whether governments should mandate masking, its about whether/how much masking actually helps.
One caveat: the only way this was going to get finalized and submitted was if I wrote it from memory, based on what I have seen and read over the past months. It is sadly lacking in links, simply due to lack of time (and my inherent laziness). I am confident the Glibertariat can remedy this shortcoming.
New Cases Stopped Rising and Started Falling
I see this one a lot now that new cases have rolled over pretty much everywhere in the US. The argument typically refers to a handful of states where the correlation between a masking order and the rollover are actually pretty good, including Arizona. I confess I haven’t done the legwork to see how masking orders line up with new case rollover in other states. And, of course, there is a big caveat: masking orders are not the same as actual masking.
There also seems to be a correlation between mass protests and a rising trend in new cases. This correlation could support masking and other lockdown orders – behavior inconsistent with those orders followed by an increase in new cases is not exactly an argument that the orders have no effect. I wonder, though, the extent to which an activity by a very limited demographic group can be the basis for a broader trend.
Correlation is not causation, of course, but it can be pretty suggestive. We are fortunate that we have a kind of control group for masking orders – states (and countries) that never had masking orders. And we see bell curves in all those places that look a lot like the bell curves in places with masking orders, the same kind of bell curve that is typical of all epidemics/pandemics. If anything, the bell curve in areas without masking orders is a little flatter – the rise to the peak is not as steep, and the peak rolls over more slowly. This raises the very distinct possibility that the apparent correlation between masking (orders) and new case rollover is spurious, an epiphenomenon.
Also of interest, very few in the US thought masking was effective against respiratory epidemics until a few months ago. The only new information that could support this about-face were the studies showing:
Masking Reduces the Spread of Droplets/Virii
For correlation to graduate to causation, you generally need a proven mechanism that connects the observed result with what is claimed to generate the observed result. We’ve all seen the flashy graphics in the reporting on studies showing masking reduces spread of droplets/virii appear to provide that mechanism.
Do these studies support the conclusion that masking caused the observed rollover in new cases? Well, leaving the spurious correlation problem aside, there are issues with making this leap. First, there is still no scientific study that actually shows that masking reduces actual transmission. Not one. There are a number of reasons why, even if you grant that masking reduces droplet spread, it doesn’t reduce disease transmission, or at least not much.
One of those reasons is that it takes a lot of discipline to actually protect yourself against a virus like SARS-2. To get the benefit of a mask, whatever that may be, you need to wear a good mask the right way.
The SARS-2 virus can also be spread by contact, typically getting it on your hands and touching your face or getting it in your eyes. I constantly find myself unconsciously resting my hands on counters or surfaces in public that have been touched by god knows how many people. If anything, wearing a mask causes people to touch their faces even more, because masks are uncomfortable.
The level of discipline it takes to protect yourself against an infectious disease is far beyond what people are demonstrating in the wild. In hospitals, the training and auditing on PPE use and handwashing is relentless. The dirty secret of N95s is that they have to be properly fitted, which is not easy, and for some people proves nearly impossible. A properly fitted and worn N95 is quite uncomfortable. Out in the wild, there is no training and very little discipline, so even the optimal level of reduced spread that might be observed in a laboratory setting is going to be reduced.
Masks Postpone Some People Getting Sick
There are three potential benefits from postponing illness, and one problem.
First, was the hope that the SARS-2 virus would not be heat tolerant, and would go away in the summer. This has turned out not to be the case. Along these same lines, there is the hope that the SARS-2 virus will do what other coronaviruses have done, and mutate into a less virulent form (there are apparently evolutionary advantages to that). This hasn’t happened yet, but it’s still a possibility.
Second, that our ability to treat COVID will improve over time, so its better to get sick later than sooner. This has proven out, at least for the very sick who get hospitalized. Length of stay and mortality rate for hospitalized COVID patients is down, although some this is likely attributable to more recent patients being younger and more resilient than the early cohorts.
Third, that we will develop a vaccine. There is much chatter about the current vaccine trials, and who knows? We may actually develop the first-ever effective coronavirus vaccine.
The ultimate goal in any pandemic, though, is herd immunity. Postponing people getting sick is postponing herd immunity and prolonging the pandemic. To the extent masks delay herd immunity, they are actually counterproductive, especially if “artificial” herd immunity via vaccination is delayed or never happens (such as with SARS-1).
It Doesn’t Do Any Harm, and Might Help
Well, its not entirely clear that masking doesn’t do any harm.
It increases the concentration of CO2 for the wearer, which is admitted in a backhanded way by the exception from the masking mandates by people with COPD and other breathing problems (who also happen to be a high risk group; one would expect these mandates to be applied first to high-risk groups, not last). It also increases the re-inhalation of bacteria and virii that they breathe out.
Masks also make communication more difficult. People with hearing problems (and I suspect many people who don’t) rely to some degree on lip-reading. Masking also muffles your voice. Arizona bizarrely has an exception from its masking mandates for people with hearing problems. Not wearing a mask doesn’t improve your hearing; the problem is everyone else wearing masks.
And, of course, there’s the nonverbal communication that masks reduce. Put on a mask, and people can’t see your face and what it expresses while you are talking (or even not talking).
Which leads me to my biggest objection to masking:
Masks are Dehumanizing
While I believe that the current tension and incivility in our country is based mainly on fear and anxiety about COVID, to some extent it is also a result of so many people being masked. In and of itself, dealing with masked people causes some level of anxiety, but its more than that.
Masks make people faceless. Someone wearing a mask isn’t fully a person to other people; they are to some degree anonymized, depersonalized, a fungible person-unit, an “other”. And nobody treats “others” as well as they do “real people”. I think its no coincidence that the fundamentalist Muslim societies who force women to wear the full niqab treat women terribly. The snapping and snarling that has become a prominent feature of the current unpleasantness can be chalked up in part to the fact that so many people are masked.
Masks also make people (feel) unaccountable. Masks not only let you hide from others, they also let you hide from yourself. The KKK wore hoods, not because they were particularly concerned with being identified and prosecuted, but because it made them more terrifying to their victims, and allowed them to do things that they might not have done bare-faced. Outlaws, criminals, and even many police units also go masked. In part, this is to avoid identification (although the extent to which SWAT teams and the like are under threat off the job is questionable), but I think it is also done because it is easier for masked people to do violence to others. Nobody wears a mask to be kind and good and charitable. A mask is a new face, a new persona, one that you can use, and then take off. Masks don’t just dehumanize you to others, they also dehumanize you to yourself. As I said, the snapping and snarling that has become a feature of the current unpleasantness can be chalked up in part to the fact that so many people are masked.
Masks have also become a vehicle for enforced conformity, which is also dehumanizing.
The dehumanizing effect of masks is, of course, unquantifiable, but I think its real, and a real problem. And a good reason to require a strong case that masking has real benefits. A case that I don’t think has been made.
LOL, wut?
AND on topic.
Fast Company used to be an interesting rag, like Wired. The left destroys all it touches.
Whole lotta derp in that link.
The stupid thing with this and many other things is that you simly cannot trust the “science” even when it comes due to excessive politicization.
It is annoying but I wear the fucking things inside stores and shit.
I usually avoid the pro mask stores, the level of certainty and religiosity they invoke is just upsetting.
here they are all pro mask
Do they have a choice?
Not where I am.
they do not
If there is no choice, then “pro” or “anti” doesn’t mean anything.
The politicization of science is quite possibly the worst trend in the past decades. We built an amazing world to live in by following the scientific method, and now we are undermining that method’s main strength because we don’t like having to put aside our whims when empirical reality contradicts them.
The politicization of science is quite possibly the worst trend in the past decades.
Indeed. It has happened before, and we should not expect the outcome to be any better this time. The first “progressive” era saw a lot of emphasis on basing government policies on the best science, culminating in the Soviet Union’s emphasis on “scientific economics” and the resulting disasters that caused. Also, eugenics, and we know where that led too.
The other argument against masks is the fact that they are disease vectors, if you have it are asymptomatic and don’t change your’s out constantly you are a walking talking radioactive surface spreading constantly every-time you touch or adjust it.
” there is the hope that the SARS-2 virus will do what other coronaviruses have done, and mutate into a less virulent form (there are apparently evolutionary advantages to that). This hasn’t happened yet, but it’s still a possibility.”
“New mutation of the coronavirus ‘may be a GOOD thing’: Strain common in Europe, America and parts of Asia is more infectious but less deadly, expert claims”
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-8637821/More-infectious-coronavirus-mutation-good-thing-says-disease-expert.html
It would be very hard to prove because just testing would be very cost prohibitive.
If I was sick, sneezing and coughing, and had to go out – wearing a mask to keep from spraying others with droplets seems like at least a courteous thing to do.
Absent that, I don’t give a fuck what you think about my virtue, just as I don’t give a fuck what you think about your own.
This is certainly different than what is happening. I think nearly 100% of people would agree with you on that in all honesty. The thing people hate is the masking of people without symptoms with little to no evidence of efficacy. In fact the guidelines tell people not to wear them without symptoms for the flu. The ? is still unanswered and won’t be honestly dealt with for at least a year is when viral shedding starts, I’ve seen a 1-2 days before symptom onset like the flu and I’ve seen 3-5 days before symptom onset. Chances are almost certainly the 1-2 day mark.
One problem with masks is that people think they are more effective than they are — that they don’t need to social distance if they are wearing a mask.
People who aren’t sick should not be distancing from others who aren’t sick. It’s probably the worst thing you could do for your immune system.
Yeah, in the before times, I always had that asshole who believed that standing behind me in the grocery line. Fuck off and out of my personal space.
We have dots on the floor now for that.
Well, how does anyone know?
To the extent masks delay herd immunity, they are actually counterproductive
This.
The whole thing has been so unrelentingly irrational and destructive, it’s mindboggling.
the college thing is really incredibly stupid given what we know. We should actively be using the colleges as wuflu incubators and promoting the idea of kids being as normal as possible with their socializing as they are largely isolated from their parents and grandparents and aren’t at risk at all.
https://www.overcomingbias.com/2020/03/variolation-may-cut-covid19-deaths-3-30x.html
Linked before, but from March: Hero Hotels*.
*althoughI would expect the spread of STDs to be bad.
no more than usual.
Think of poor teachers/professors, you shitlord!
It’s not like they ever actually show up to class.
Hey now.
I don’t generally care to much. I wear the mask to walk into the gym, and then promptly take it off to work out. I have several times for work where i have to travel to locations where it is required.
Something i find peculiar is how this has become such a focus. We have tons of other restrictions, that seem to be ignored in favor of fighting the masks.
In short, It’s not that i’m upset about picking a hill to die on, i just wish that we hadn’t let a whole bunch of other important hills go and then focus on this one.
The masks:
1. Are highly visible
2. Apply to every person
3. Have high symbolic value
4. Have low pragmatic value
This makes them a perfect Culture War target, and every issue is ultimately a retread of the Culture War anymore.
I think the application to everyone, and the ease of flaunting it, are the two factors that made it a point of contention, because its not like you have to go be on the street every day to fight against it, like you might due to your gym or job being closed.
You know the more i think about it, I think that that itself gives it some virtue in this form of protest. It doesn’t require you to be constantly fighting and raging on the street. Just a simple act of defiance.
It is interesting when at Walmart, those of us unmasked always say hello to each other, while some stare at us like freaks. In BhC, everyone is nice, so it sucks when you cant see people, no one speaks. The park OTOH, very few masks, and everyone acts normally
It is interesting when at Walmart, those of us unmasked always say hello to each other, while some stare at us like freaks.
Virtue signalling is not exclusive to one side.
We always say Hi In BhC, this is normal, not virtue signalling, I live in the sticks Tulpa!
Virtue signalling is not exclusive to one side.
I would say it’s less about virtue signalling and more about camaraderie among members of a persecuted group. These are not opposite sides of the same coin.
People who don’t wear masks might laugh at those who do for being fearful of the boogeyman. At most, the masked might have some mocking to deal with.
In contrast, the vitriol, intimidation, and even physical violence directed against those who don’t wear masks is unreal. I regularly read and hear that people who don’t wear masks are murderers and retribution/enforcement actions are needed against them.
That’s because the hominid brain has evolved since at least the Miocene to impart a strong cognitive bias against sources of contagion. Avoidance of disease is hardwired prime directive of our thought that is behind so many of our behaviors and rituals.
I dunno, HM. That may be a contributing factor, but I think its more ingroup/outgroup identification plus the underlying level of stress and anxiety generally.
@RC
I agree. It’s a multivariate, heady, and toxic brew. The formation of tribes and identification of the other is also another cognitive bias that helped our monkey mind in the savanna but is not so evolutionary beneficial now.
It Doesn’t Do Any Harm, and Might Help
I didn’t like this argument when it was called Pascal’s Wager and I still don’t like it.
Alternately, why don’t we all just convert to Orthodox Christianity? It doesn’t do any harm, and it might help!
*Eddie’s ears perk up*
He did say Orthodox, not Roman Catholic.
A little from column A and a little from column B. He was, as I recall, a member of the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church which is a church in full communion with the Bishop of Rome but not, strictly speaking, the Roman Catholic Church.
Splitters!
We lived near a Byzantine Catholic Church in San Diego. And I do find the history of the VERY early churches to be fascinating, e.g. the Ethiopian Church.
That one always annoyed me as well.
It acts as though there’s only one option. There are hundreds of other religions to choose from, and most of them describe some punishment for not believing – the “wager” tells you nothing about which one you should choose. Christianity, Judaism, and Islam alone take you up to three. If you get into specific denominations and sects, you’re probably in the hundreds if not thousands. Suddenly this “wager” doesn’t seem so cut and dry.
I’m not saying that every religious person is a dummy or that there are no intelligent arguments at all for the existence of God, but this “wager” just rankles me.
–Discworld
Just look at the different flavors of Christianity and some of the vitriol between them.
From Sean’s link:
What would seem like a common-sense measure has been debated by some as an infringement on their rights, often ending in the latest viral tantrum of the week. While 72% of Americans say they always or very often use a face mask in public, there’s still a niggling 18% who say they rarely or never wear a mask, according to a recent Gallup poll.
The anti-masker issue is largely an American one that’s only abetted by the dismal response and action from the Trump administration—all of which has made America the global leader in COVID-19 cases by a wide margin.
Aaand done.
This is simply a lie, we have a higher percentage of mask approval than most of the 1st world.
I “rarely” wear a mask because I’m mostly following all the other stupid rules that make me not want to go anywhere.
As for the 72%, for many of them “most of the time” is doing a lot of work in their answers. Sure, they wear the mask when going to the grocery store or out for a jog, but then they’ll spend 3 hours in close quarters singing karoake with friends and that’s when they get COVID-19 (which may not be a bad thing). Then the media will turn around and yell at the 18% many of whom aren’t contracting the disease.
My kingdom for an edit button.
What I’m trying to say is that the Gallup poll is misleading because it is capturing identity and not behavior. The 72% are the right-thinkers but that’s not the same as being right-actors, and of course this doesn’t get into the fact that the masks are not very effective according to the same studies that are used to justify the mandates. The shame game is being played against the 18% who are wrong-thinkers but no evidence has been presented that wrong-think is the actual cause of the problem.
So, who are the remaining 10%?
People who tell pollsters to fuck off.
*raises hand*
Well they were probably drinking while doing karaoke with their friends so you can’t get the bug while drinking or eating at a restaurant with your mask down. This is known.
Only if you’re sitting. If you’re standing, the COVID will get you.
Same as if you’re eating or drinking too late. COVID’s gonna get you.
If you’re entering a restaurant with a mask off, you’re a heathen and a heretic. If you take it off when you sit down, you’re good – even if you’re sitting right next to the door. If you leave it off when you exit through the same door you entered, you’re still good.
This is some people’s algorithm.
So I’m A Niggler?
/Maskist!
What percentage of Americans are required by force of “executive order” to wear them? What does “in public” mean? I won’t even address the Trump in their heads.
GIGO
all of which has made America the global leader in COVID-19 cases by a wide margin.
Conveniently laying aside the fact that the US has the third largest population in the world while also being among the most interconnected nations (both inter- and intra-nationally), essentially guaranteeing that it would be the global leader in cases no matter what was done (well, except maybe a China or New Zealand style totalitarian lock-down, but that wouldn’t fly here).
“The anti-masker issue is largely an American one”
I’ve been watching European bike races on TV and have been surprised at how few people I see wearing masks, and this is in Spain, France and Italy, countries that got hit hard. Maybe the behavior is different in cities, but I suspect that just as many Europeans are anti-mask as Americans.
I watched a tennis event in Croatia a couple months ago and the tennis media went apeshit when everyone caught the ‘vid.
No follow up on how many got sick and died. I did see some of the pos players at later events.
Athletes are in little danger from Wuhan. Even tennis players. No idea if baseballers have anything to fret over though.
N95 masks not only have to be fitted, No Facial Hair! I laugh when I see guys with th full Mountain Man Beard and a an N95 mask stuffed over it, Morons.
Nice explainer RC!
I will not cut my glorious beard for any totemic mask.
(I will cut it because it’s annoying to have to keep washing my moustache after every meal because it dipped into the food)
ah yes, that’s why Yusef is clean face,
I don’t have a beard and still have a dirty face.
/Sloppy eater
So much this. Or, stubble at most.
solved
I’m too English to wear the Amish beard.
That’s why the mustache gets trimmed. The beard just gets to grow longer.
Then you end up looking silly.
N95 masks not only have to be fitted, No Facial Hair!
There’s exceptions, helpfully detailed in this hilarious CDC chart (TW: pdf). Its names for each beard style that make it worth clicking.
Couldn’t they just use “Hitler” instead of “Toothbrush”?
Or “ChiMo” instead of “pencil”.
Chinese Mohammad? Aren’t they persecuted?
Short for “Child Molester”, so yes, they are persecuted.
I wear an N95 with a beard because the mask was free.
There’s a class of N95 masks that do not require a fit test for use. Those were designed and approved for use by the general public during an influenza pandemic over a decade ago. This was also coincidental with a recommendation for masking by the general public during a pandemic (that was ignored because there was a PPE mask shortage).
We got a batch of those. We ran them through our fit testing protocol anyway (they were our last resort for people who couldn’t get fitted with the other ones).
Guess what? Some of them still failed fit testing.
hah…..when I do wear a mask because I have no choice (which is getting distressingly common), I do exactly that. I don’t have a big burly ZZ Top beard, but it’s enough to make the mask pointless.
It seems to me that somebody once came up with a style of mustache that works well with a mask. Hiller, Butler, something like that.
I believe you’re thinking of Mr. Hilter, he’s running in the North Minehead by-election
On topicish?
https://91-divoc.com/pages/covid-visualization/
I didn’t know that the EU was experiencing a “second wave”.
They have just begun to ramp up testing in most places. It’s a casedemic.
Ahh. Ok that makes sense
The EU’s positivity rate is showing a bump from @ 1.5% to @ 5.0%, which is concerning, but positivity is also driven by testing protocols – who is getting the tests? Anybody who wants one, symptomatic or not? Only people with a cluster of symptoms? So its hard to know for sure.
During winter time (really cold/flu season), you’d expect the positivity rate to fall as covid like symptoms are more common. During summer when colds are minimal and seasonal allergies are lessened, it’s logical that non covid symptoms are less common so less of a reason to get tested.
Another possibility is more use of rapid but less accurate type of tests.
It was Sweden that done it. They’re like the Indiana of Covid.
Alternately, why don’t we all just convert to Orthodox Christianity? It doesn’t do any harm, and it might help!
We could wear our shoes on the wrong feet. We could get special bracelets with magical plague-repelling incantations inscribed on them.
I have successfully converted my entire stock of tiger-repelling rocks into covid-repelling rocks. Only $19.95!
Only if it comes with a pouch that is MOLLE compatible.
That is an additional $65.95 plus shipping and handling, or four easy payments of $19.98 plus shipping and handling.
*grumbles*
There’s probably an up-charge for multi-cam too…
Oh, you didn’t want the pigeon-shit pattern?
Can I get a 2nd one free if I pay the additional shipping and handling? I’m on a fixed income
Fixed income? No income? No problem!
https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/coronavirus/france-activate-riot-police-enforce-mandatory-mask-wearing
Fuck the French. Click the link just to see the outfit this chick is rocking.
Ther’es more material in those boots than the rest of the outfit combined.
Some serious Texas Cultural Appropriation going on there.
The mask ruins the look,
Yep.
She made that out of curtains, a la the Sound of Music?
Or maybe Carol Burnett
I thought of Carol Burnett’s send-up of Gone With the Wind.
Masks make people faceless.
I never really thought that hard about it, but I try to smile at people. I’m not as “intimidating” as I once was, but in a myriad of daily interactions with people, a smile and a nod are a means of expressing goodwill. It’s cheap and easy.
Now, that’s not available. It makes a difference.
I catch myself doing that all the time. I smile and realize nobody can see it.
They can as long as you remember to also flex the muscles around your eyes.
I have resting indifference face.
Once you can feign sincerity, things become a lot easier.
Doesn’t help when you’re wearing sunglasses as well as the mask.
My daughter works in a nursing home with old people. She hates the mask, says the old people want to recognize her and her cheerful smile.
My daughter works in a nursing home with old people. She hates the mask, says the old people want to recognize her and her cheerful smile.
I don’t know what the right hill to die on is, but I’m not going to die on this one, not even so much as wearing one with subversive messages. I’m a compliant sheep because I do not want to rock the boat for reasons I no longer feel safe sharing here. I am not going to draw attention to myself.
“reasons I no longer feel safe sharing here” You’re not the only one Mo, it’s too late for me, Save Yourself,
I’m sorry. Might I ask if you’re worried about glib reactions, or about the fact that it’s too easy to conenct back to your real identity from statements here?
One night, I said somethong relatively innocuous and out of the blue, I was viciously attacked over my personal life, complete with profanity, with concurrence from someone else, both longstanding commenters.
I don’t know who’s watching, who’s reading, and who’s going to use it to leverage something.
I’m sorry that happened, for whatever that’s worth.
Thanks. It’s still sticking in my craw, but I haven’t flounced, haven’t faded out. I’m just more careful.
I appreciate this place too much to leave over one or two people.
That’s the smart way to react. Sorry to read about that.
Did you get attacked here, or on one of personal spaces elsewhere? I would expect NAP violations would get a ban here.
It was here. I’m not looking to get anybody banned, but I am always now cognizant of the fact that I don’t know who’s reading.
Me too. Sorry Mo. I don’t recall what and when that happened, but if it was me drunken posting, or non drunken posting, I apologize profusely.
I know I’ve written things I regret later.
That’s terrible, you’re one of the nicest people here Mo, I guess people suck?
/I’m a Terrible Person..
FWIW I enjoy your musings.
Thankee!, for a minute I thought it was me that said bad things about you,
You and I have had out squabbles but we ironed them out. I consider you a friend and I care about you.
I hope this wasn’t me about the seatbelt thing 🙁
This mask thing has changed my attitude on seatbelts.
As long as you’re not in my car, I don’t care whether you wear one, it’s your own decision to make.
I don’t want to be told to wear a mask “for my own good” so I’m not going to argue whether people whould put on a seat belt anymore.
^^ this.
My sister was trying to compare the mask to a seat belt. She didn’t like that one of my reasons for wearing a seat belt was to avoid getting a ticket.
I wear my seatbelt because 60% ticket and 40% I drive like a fucking maniac.
Seatbelt laws are bullshit.
This mask thing has changed my attitude on seatbelts.
The only reason* I’ve ever cared about other people wearing seatbelts is because I’m of the opinion that it is easier to clear a wreck off of the road and get traffic moving again if all the body parts are confined to the vehicle instead of spread out over the road after someone goes flying through the windshield.
*OK, fine, I do care about people I care about wearing one for their own safety, but that’s a drop in the bucket of drivers.
I wear a seatbelt because I was not wearing one in a crash when I was 14. I should’ve died, but for some reason, I did not fly through the windshield, but slid down and then popped up.
I bruised my knee, dislocated my hip, and cracked my pelvis. Traction for 4 days, crutches for six weeks.
The biggest upside was starting my freshman year of high school a month late and then when I showed up, the guidance counselor asked a junior girl guidance aide to show me around and take me to my locker.
She was most beautiful girl I had ever laid eyes on. We ended up dating the next year for a little bit (which was weird for the 2-year age gap)
No! You were quite kind that night and I appreciate it.
OMG sorry. People suck 🙁
I want to confess – it was me. I told her she was no longer the worst, and I called her a Glibbitch. In my defense, I also referred to myself as a Glibbitch, but in Mojeaux’s case, it was uncalled for, and I’ve just been sick about it ever since. Can you find it in your heart to forgive me, Moje?
GROUP HUG!!!!
Yeah! Let’s get all the Glibboys in on it!
I’m not hugging Crusty – YOU hug him!
Crusty’s nice. You just have to be very careful where you touch.
Don’t consider yourself a complaint sheep, you’re just applying Gray Man Theory.
: ( Sorry about the situation. Let me know if ya’ll need anything.
I wear a mask here out in public for the same reason- Kroger has beer. Kroger is following Gauleiter Gov. Dewine’s edict that masks are worn. I want beer. Am I going to get in an argument with some Karen cunte because I want to run in and get some TallCans® and back out?
I do have to laugh when they ask me to take off the mask so they can card me though.
I refuse to participate in Convid-1984 mask minstrel theater.
When push came to shove, I realized it wasn’t a hill I was going to die on either. I’ll still avoid wearing one if at all possible, to include changing my shopping habits to avoid stores that require them. But if a business demands it, and I need what they’re selling, I put on the damn face diaper and comply. I still hate them. They still make me angry every time I give in and wear them, and when I do comply and see someone else in the store not wearing a mask, I feel like a total asshole. But I’m not going to cause a scene or risk police involvement over it. I’ll just pray everyone else comes to their senses eventually.
I have until labor day to decide if I’m going to risk my job over their mask mandate.
Best of luck. Maybe we’ll get some actual research showing masks are dumb and they’ll back off.
FWIW I suspect that once the cold weather ramps up we’ll be right back where we are now.
Yeup but now that Not Adahn has brpught up Gray Man Theory (had to look it up, thanks!), I don’t feel like such a sheep. You do what you gotta do to get what you want, right? Well, today I wanted foam board.
MMMM Foam Board……………..
/ponders a new project,
A conspiracy wall?
I’m upping my photography game now that I’m selling my needlework stuff on Etsy.
When we were in Arkansas, they had big signs in front of the Kroger saying a local ordinance required you to wear a mask to enter the store. So my husband and I sighed, went back to the truck and got the stupid masks, then entered the store. And while the majority of shoppers were masked up, by the time we’d hit the second aisle, we realized it wasn’t even close to ALL of them. Even worse, we passed by some unmasked guy in the store during the trip and he gave my husband such a look, like “You just lost your man card, buddy.” Heads they win, tails I lose.
The “blue” gun shop that was allowed to stay open while it’s competitors were closed forbids entry with a mask on. They have a sign saying “This is a gun shop. If you try and enter with a mask on we will assume you are here to rob us and act accordingly.” They also have done no remodeling unlike the tax cattle shops that have had to reduce square footage and put up sneezeguards.
There isn’t a lot of square footage in that building to begin with.
Both it and Zack’s are much smaller than the other two I’ve been to down here (The Outdoors Man and Calamity Jane’s Firearms and Fine Shoes. The latter is a bit too far out to visit regularly.)
This is the gun store equivalent of Daddy cleaning his shotgun in front of the daughter’s boyfriend.
I’m sure they think the sign makes them look hard and not to be fucked with, but in reality it makes them look look a bunch of putzes.
Maybe I’m unfairly stereotyping, but I have the impression that cops love tuff talk.
I’ve decided that I wear a mask whenever the store has a sign that says to. Their property, their rules, even if the government is forcing them. I think. I’ve considered only doing it when specifically asked.
same here. Same with carrying a gun, wearing a shirt, and any other requests they may have. I also take it into account when deciding where to shop next time. The mask thing is ubiquitous here, but the gun thing isn’t.
It’s only their store and their rules to the extent that they have discretion over what to do. For mask mandates, it’s the state’s store for purposes of masking. Note how many of the signs explicitly say they are requiring one because of EOs.
I don’t wear a mask because of signage. I will put one on, or leave, if an employee of the store tells me I need to. I quit shopping at Home Depot because some employee yelled at me to put one on, while employees at Lowes have never said a word about it.
I hear ya. I struggle with it.
Honestly, the tie-breaker for me may be that so many people are in such a state of anxiety (footnote: TMITE) that I wear it more out of concern(?) for them than any other reason. There’s a ton of old people in Tucson, and a lot of them are really scared. I’m not worried about Karens (there are days I would relish the opportunity to release some of my anger on one). But I feel bad for the people who have been suckered.
I just don’t want to get in a pissing match with some Karen in the cereal aisle. OK, part of me does, but the reasonable part of me just wants to get in, get out, and not come back for a long time.
Now that the “study” came out showing that the neck gaiters are worse then not wearing a mask. I make it a point that’s what I’m going to wear as much as possible now. Low grade malicious compliance.
The authors of the study have backtracked and said that it was only the specific gaiter they used, which was very thin. They didn’t want to extrapolate to all gaiters. #NotAllGaiters
I’m sure the chinese piece of underwear fabric with earloops I wear is super efficient.
It has been washed at least once since its April purchase date.
It is in my pocket 90% of the time; only to be worn where required.
The gaiter I have was made in China, I can see through it if I pull it over my eyes, and I’m sure it does nothing except keeping dust out of my beard and keeping me from being bothered by Branch Covidians.
What’s the demographic of people who wear neck gaiters?
Something tells me that it’s part of the Icky Class (at least, from the point of view of the sort of people doing the “studies” and reporting on them).
17yo XX does at work.
Well… I think i missed the squabble. So sorry about that. And if it was me, know i did not mean to offend if i some how did.
Naw.
You know that like half the commenters here just went “oh shit, how drunk was I? I hope it wasn’t me!”
#metoo
LOL. Who else goes back and reviews their posts, and says, “Well that was stupid. Bad grammar there. Typo. Punctuation, how does it work? WTF was I thinking? Jello wrestling?”
*Head Desk*
Not me.
Because I’m not a cheap-ass freeloader who won’t pay for a Glibertarians.com Gold-Level (TM) account complete with edit button and access to the Edit Fairy’s OnlyFans posts.
We take bitcoin.
I tried paying, but all I got in my swag bag was a turtleneck for my penis, used by the look of it.
You mean you can PAY for first class treatment here?
You should just name the accused so as to avoid the 50 responses of people asking if it was them. If you aren’t sure if it was you, it wasn’t you.
I shouldn’t have said anything at all. *mwah* to you tho.
So you’re saying it was Brochettard.
Same here. I’ve always been that way.
Sorry.
In general with masks, I won’t wear them or do business with a place that requires them on their own.
If a place is under a government ordinance/mandate/what-have-you, I’ll bend a bit if it is a place I like. There are some businesses in Nashua, NH that I like that I still patronize, and the staff have asked me to wear a mask when I walk in and out. So for those places, I’ll put the mask on for the minimum amount of time to make the staff happy. There is a place in Nashua that I patronize that completely, totally ignores the city’s mask ordinance. I like patronizing that place.
Unfortunately, every major grocery store in New Hampshire has a mask mandate, issued on their own. Many places have exceptions for medical reasons. I understand that at some stores the store management will assume if you walk in without a mask that you have a medical reason for not wearing a mask and won’t bother you over it. Those stores are up North, and not close to me. There is a place in Manchester that asks people to wear masks but does not require them, but that place is extremely expensive. Think a local version of Whole Food but more expensive. So, I signed up for Instacart. My money goes to a grocery store chain that mandates masks on their own, but I don’t wear a mask for grocery shopping. So far, so good.
I should have been more clear. “Sorry” refers to ” I do not want to rock the boat for reasons I no longer feel safe sharing here”. Whatever it was that happened, either I’m forgetting or I missed it, is not cool.
You pick whatever hill it is you want to die on. We all make choices about that, there’s nothing wrong with picking a different one than what others pick.
Uffda. Sorry to hear about that Mojeaux. You know I was just kidding about KC BBQ right? I mean it isn’t Memphis BBQ, but it is Ok for you prairie rubes.
Really this place is special to me because it seems like the only ray of sunshine on a lot of days. I would be so sad if I felt like someone personally attacked me here (except Tundra, because he just doesn’t know better).
I took care of the Memphis v Kansas City BBQ question in the acknowledgments of Cods & Cuntes. You are wrong. Now everybody knows this.
“In and of itself, dealing with masked people causes some level of anxiety, but its more than that.”
Mrs. TOK has anxiety issues, and the few times she tried wearing a mask ended up in a panic attack. Not only wearing a mask, but being around people wearing them, is a problem. So now that we have a state-wide mandate, she can no longer go shopping, to my kid’s volleyball games, etc. By and large most people are not sympathetic and tell her to just suck it up. This from a society that allows all kinds of support animals in stores and on airplanes.
Don’t get me started on that bullshit.
no worse than sticking your kid in the cart with their filthy little feet……
I’m not sure why the goat wouldn’t just walk.
the hooves fall through the wire grate and it gets stuck.
That’s how you keep it from running away. It’s the same trick as sticking it’s hind legs in your rubber boots. So I’ve heard.
Don’t get me started on that bullshit too.
Well, i’ll get started. If you ain’t blind, you can cache me outside with that.
I just got another call from a client whose 2 family is now 1/2 empty because the tenant has an ’emotional support’ dog which scares off prospects for the other unit. The ADA is an abomination. Compassion with all the costs imposed on third parties is not compassionate.
I referred to the ADA when it passed as the “attorney full employment act”.
You’ll also note that the kinder and gentler George W. Bush signed that bill. At the time I was young and foolish enough to think that an R signing such a thing was an exception and not a rule.
H.W. My kingdom for an edit button!
Ah compassion-fascists, my favorite people. The original virtue signalers weren’t all lefties you know.
Does their dog look like this?
With a tail and chain fade?
Creepy.
They photoshopped it because there is no way on earth you could hold that beast with one hand. I’d love to see what the chain is actually attached to.
Look at how little deflection that guy is able to get in the course of the chain. It’s barely off flat.
Blink dog.
Brindle but otherwise spot on.
Could this be another libertarian wedge issue?
I am very pro-bring your pet with you on a flight. I enjoy sitting next to someone with a furball vastly better than one bringing their snotball.
If there were no pet/no child seating, where I’d be guaranteed not to be near one of the annoyances, I’d be okay with other parts of the aircraft having them.
I am pro pets at work. I am more pro business owner is the sole person with any say in the matter. Mandating it creates situations like the emotional support pit bull that cost a client $6000 in lost rents keeping a unit vacant while the dog emotionally supported its owner by terrifying everyone else.
Obviously, mandates in either direction are an overreach. I do find it interesting that the the pet bans are universally about health.” What was the last pandemic we had that was caused by dogs?
Well, we ban our own therapy and security animals from parts of our facility.
But we’re kind of an outlier.
Maybe not dogs. But what if this whole things was started by an emotional support bat? Did you think of that?
Sit next to a chihuahua or some shit, same difference.
I am pro-let businesses decide. I am anti-government mandate.
#metoo
I’ve had emotional support dogs snap at me on the plane. I’m fine with them being there as long as I don’t get kicked off the flight for throwing the damn thing when it bites my arm .
This times 10,000. I would pay extra for seats guaranteeing no one under 20 would sit next to me.
Don’t other my support gerbil, shitlord!
You’re Richard Gere. Confirmed.
Ghost of gerbil haunts area man’s rectum.
Put the mask on a leash and tell people its her emotional support mask.
LOL
THAT is a great point I never thought of.
There are a number of reasons why, even if you grant that masking reduces droplet spread, it doesn’t reduce disease transmission, or at least not much.
I have seen nothing which indicates any attempt to find a firm correlation between “droplets” and “effective dose”.
They have decided about seven different times how the disease is actually spread. Droplets on surfaces or aersolized? If droplets, then some possible benefit of a mask, but if airborne vapor, then masks are counter-productive.
And there is still no definitive answer on even that ‘simple’ question.
Or if asymptomatic actually are spreading – which is the justification for essentially all of us wearing masks. Show me some evidence, pretty please?
“To the extent masks delay herd immunity, they are actually counterproductive, especially if “artificial” herd immunity via vaccination is delayed or never happens (such as with SARS-1).”
I can understand that (especially in the beginning) you want to slow the spread to a more manageable level. But if the point is to *slow* the spread instead of *stopping* the spread, any measures you take will necessarily need to be leaky. Which means that if masks work, just having some or most people use them will be better than 100% compliance.
here’s the thing the masks theoretically only work if everyone is wearing them because the viral particles can still enter through your eyes.
This was posted earlier and I have found it informative.
a very good read, thanks for enacting the link labor!
That is excellent. I’ve already reposted it to Facederp.
I should get wails and moans from my leftie acquaintances.
Let me know how it goes.
I’m already getting some pushback on the lack of WE’RE ALL GOING TO DIE, but nothing major yet.
To be honest, my desired audience are the ones who don’t post often. They need to know they’re not alone.
I also found the climate trends interesting and something that not many people are considering. It’s just those “morons in Florida.”
Think my favorite part of this mask insanity is having to get carded at the liquor/grocery store with a mask on the entire time.
My favorite is being forced to wear a mask to enter the lobby of my credit union. It’s completely bass ackwards to their usual policy.
Last time I was at the booze depot, they carded me and said “OK, that’s you” (I was picking up an order and they were confirming identity). I asked “How can you tell?” Got a laugh.
The 7 orphans struggling under the weight of the entire production of Islay for 2002?
He didn’t even actually go to the store, it was one orphan on another orphan’s shoulders in a trench coat.
Same guys who show up to work when he’s hung-over.
When the mask thing first started there were some viral videos of underage kids bragging about getting booze using the hide-your-face method and old-person get-up/wigs. I’d imagine that is still going on, but that the kids have wizened up not to brag about it online.
Add to the negatives an increased number of nasal staph infections from wearing unclean masks.
I have anecdotal evidence from an ENT.
Huh. My dad is in the hospital with pneumonia one day after having to wear a mask at his oncologist appointment. Now I wonder if they are related.
The thing that I keep going back to are the studies that show that disposable surgical masks don’t actually prevent infections _during surgery_, the use for which they are specifically designed. It strikes me that if that’s the case, and the medical literature seems pretty damned clear on it, then you’re facing an awfully high evidence bar to clear when asserting that they’re gonna prevent infections in grocery stores. And you’d need an even higher bar to attach the penalty of criminal law to not wearing one.
But whatever, we’re fucked. Richard Reid tried to blow up his shoes in December 2001, so we’re approaching 19 years of taking our shoes off at the airport. Gonna guess “masks everywhere” will be a similar timeline.
According to the ADA, you don’t have to wear a mask, and Stores Cannot ask you why,
in my case it’s COPD
This should be broadcast nationwide.
That’s what I’ve been saying. Every single time there’s a catastrophe, the government rolls out some “emergency measures” that remain there forever. It happened with WW1, it happened with 9/11, and it will happen with this. Libertarians are the only ones who express concern about the long-term trajectory of civil liberties, and they’re written off by almost everyone as crazy conspiracy theorists.
The Righties I know range from “rebellious” to “mildly annoyed but compliant” on the various Covid-related diktats. Meanwhile, the Lefties are cheering for more and dismissing outright the idea that this will damage civil liberties. They seriously want me to believe that the government will just repeal all this stuff when the virus winds down.
South Carolina masking orders (they are city by city, but all started about same time that did them) started July 1, 49 days ago. That was half way up exponential slope, at 249.1 cases/million/day. The peak was 18 days later at 378.5. We are currently at 160.8.
Does that peak line up with the masking laws? Probably. 2.5 weeks after law goes into effect, seems about right if they work. But I don’t see any dent in the shape of the curve anywhere, looks like the curves look everywhere else. The laws went in about 3 weeks after the start of the exponential. Enough time to recognize the curve and panic and pass the laws. So even if the masks have zero effect, I think this is exactly what the curve would look like.
The big thing you have to worry about with all of this is the regression fallacy: IE that interventions tend to be implemented when data is approaching an unusual or extreme level, and that it is quite likely the data will moderate from there, whether an intervention is taken or not.
One of the most famous in sports is the tendency for teams to improve after replacing their head coach or manager. Teams almost always do this after a run of results that were “disappointing,” IE negative deviated from prior expectations. So the only way there won’t be an improvement with the new coach, is that if negative things continue to happen that weren’t expected to happen in the first place. All other outcomes bring improvement. Announcers often ascribe the improvement to “the change,” when the improvement was likely to come regardless.
Yeah, that was kind of my point in the latter part. By the time they got around to passing the law, we were well up the curve, really wasn’t much more to do other than peak and start down. It can’t exponential forever.
And the exponential started with opening enough that tourists started visiting the state in normalish numbers. Damn yankees dragging the NYflu down south.
Does that peak line up with the masking laws?
Not really. The lag is too long. The window for getting an infection closes 10 – 14 days after exposure.
There’s also that like with lockdowns, voluntary individual choices. It didn’t go from zero mask wearing to 100% just because a governor issued an edict.
That’s one of the things that really pisses me off with the mask nazis is they think government ordering people is a quick and easy way to achieve their aims, rather than evidence and rationality. They think it’s the way to do just about everything, kick up opposition and act like Steve Urkel. Public choice theory is something right up there with alien abductions in their minds.
Does that peak line up with the masking laws?
It might be a coincidence. Consider Farr’s Law https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/covid-19-william-farrs-way-out-of-the-pandemic/
Couple that with the observation the curves nearly everywhere on Earth suggests COVID runs a cycle of incline, peak, and decline within a timeframe of 60-70 days. Which means if after 3 weeks of incline you get a peak two weeks (35 days total) later. Knowing that mandating a mask order at 3 weeks will look an awful lot like it was the masks that caused the peak.
Case in point AZ “allowed” local mask orders after a week of handwringing by the local press, on June 19. Curiously it hits a peak around June 29.
https://azdhs.gov/preparedness/epidemiology-disease-control/infectious-disease-epidemiology/covid-19/dashboards/index.php
Add to the negatives an increased number of nasal staph infections from wearing unclean masks.
*considers replacing wadded up mask of unknown age, currently in pocket*
I wear a mask here out in public for the same reason- Kroger has beer. Kroger is following Gauleiter Gov. Dewine’s edict that masks are worn. I want beer. Am I going to get in an argument with some Karen cunte because I want to run in and get some TallCans® and back out?
Same. I wear the stupid thing (improperly, as in never over my nose) when I go to the grocery store.
I don’t need the aggravation I’m a lazy slob.
Honestly, if masks had been required March 1 (or Feb 15) and no other restrictions put on*, I would have been okay with it.
*2 exceptions, lock down nursing homes and quarantine the actual sick.
I believe back then TPTB were telling us that masks were not needed for all of us. But I probably have a faulty memory (as in one that lacks an appropriate hole in which to dispense bad thought).
Your memory is just fine, which just leads to the problems with it later on.
Same with Fauci. He lied right out of the gate, so fuck him.
On the drive home yesterday, I noticed the NPR mikejockey had ditched “latinx” for actual Spanish adjectives. I don’t know if that means that fad has died, or if it was because she was interviewing Julian Castro.
My understanding is that many Spanish speakers hated it.
Ahem, it’s Castrix, you misogynist.
I’d vote for Asterix or Obelix.
It’s not polite to mask-debate in public.
What pisses me off the most about the masks are the private businesses that have predictably caved on the issue. A few Karen’s complaining about mask wearing and corporations cave. AMC movie theaters weren’t going to require masks until there was a social media backlash. So some dumb fucks on Twitter who aren’t representative of anything get to dictate policy to the rest of us. It’s even worse than democracy because it doesn’t even take a majority. I work for a company that put a mandatory mask policy because they received, in their own words, over 70 submissions from employees asking for it. 70 in a large company.
The response from day 1 to all of this shit should have been to tell the very old to stay the fuck home as much as possible, and that would have sent the message to everyone else that this is about personal accountability. If you are so damn worried about the virus, stay home. Everyone else can proceed and society can function.
All of these problems would have been solved by some kind of blanket litigation shield for all business’s.
The Dems went apeshit at the mere suggestion.
The worst thing about this century is that social media acts like a megaphone for the heckler’s veto.
And like real megaphones, 9 out of 10 users should not have one.
I thought it was Justin Bieber.
Eventually he’ll buy a Lambo and die in a crash.
Remember when we thought Nickleback was the worst thing humanity could experience? We were so innocent then.
We really should quarantine Canada.
A really, really big megaphone when you consider how many of these things are driven by, at most, a few hundred people.
What baffles me is how many times we have discovered that Twitter and Reality are vastly different, but that corporate PR departments and journalos still think that Twitter is an accurate representation of how people feel/think.
Brexit, Trump, the last elections in the UK. All of them were back-assward but people still think that they have to listen to social media.
I think that there are a lot of corporations that are worried that if somehow 5 people get the Rona in one of their stores they will be crucified. They hope that by licking the boots of all Karens they might be able to avoid some vitriol if that happens.
But it won’t work. If something bad happens at the store, the Karens won’t care that you made everyone mask up. They’ll find some reason that it was all your fault that you killed granny.
And like Jim Crow laws, the big stores used the govt to prevent their competitors from being able to offer the consumer options. If it wasn’t for Jim Crow laws a lot of businesses would have treated blacks like any other customer. And with mask mandates Home Depot doesn’t have to compete with the local hardware store that is willing to treat you like an adult.
When Menard’s started mandating masks, I took my business elsewhere. Then the mask mandate came and now I am back at Menards (mostly because I know where everything is there).
We went full-mandate very early so I don’t know what it’s like to have a choice.
The venn diagram of the militant mask karens and the militant antismoking people has to be close to a circle.
It looks like the local mask law is going to get an addition 60 days. It originally ran until end of Aug, that will extend it until end of Oct. I think Oct 28, to be exact. It looked like a 30 day extension was going to happen, which I thought would be enough. Looking at curve, SC would be down to background levels by end of Sept.
I am not planning on going back to office if I have to wear a mask (law doesn’t cover private offices, IIRC, but I don’t know what company will do). I would like to get back to working in office, at least some, but I am not going to wear a mask at work.
I posted this Dilbert on Facebook last Sunday.
Apparently, my mask-wearing friends aren’t smart enough recognize when they are being called out.
this is wrong. science may have been wrong in the past but it is settled now. there is nothing left to research.
The masks are about virtue signaling, and showing your submission to the religion that is the state. As became clear to me when my brother got angrier and angrier at me in a phone and then text conversation when I calmly defended me not wearing a mask because they don’t fucking work. He concluded by cutting me out of his life because I allegedly didn’t share his “core values” of caring and compassion and dignity (enforced at gunpoint for the recalcitrant).
Tell your brother you have plenty of compassion and hope him a speedy recovery from his various mental disorders.
I’m not even sure you should trust that there is a correlation either.
Kansas cooked the books big time to make it seem like their mask mandate led to an immediate downturn in cases.
It is also infuriating when you see govt hacks twist data like this without repercussions. Yet, they go after Exxon for not warning investors about global warming?
If the press had any decency, they’d be howling for the blood of politicians and health dept bureaucrats for the damage they’ve done.
Doom and gloom is an interesting strategy. Let’s see ho it plays out.
Rice said, “I think people may not fully appreciate just how much we have lost in terms of our national security and our standing in the world over the last four years. Our allies don’t know what to make of us. We’re not leading them with confidence based on principle and shared values. We’re lying from the White House. The president of the United States is a liar, and the whole world knows it. We are incompetent. We are supposed to be the most scientifically advanced country in the world, and we have been at the bottom of the heap in dealing with the pandemic. The president praises Vladimir Putin and Kim Jong-un and thinks Xi Jinping, the leader of China, is the great leader to be emulated. It’s just nuts. Everything is upside down.”
She added, “I’m deeply, deeply concerned that, if we had four more years of this, we would not be an America that anybody can recognize. The situation would be unsalvageable. Our national security and standing in the world, irreparably damaged. It’s a life and death situation we’re in. It’s not too extreme a statement to make both domestically and internationally.”
Nothing like giving tacit approval to civil wars in the ME to improve our standing in the world.
Or the spineless kowtowing that gave Iran the courage to seize US sailors in the gulf.
Yeah, that was a great standing – under everyone’s boot with their hands in our wallet. We should only be under our own boot!
She’s in theoretical legal jeopardy with the Russian collusion nonsense so I’d expect her to fight like hell for Biden even before partisanship is taken into account.
They really hit on the “President is a Liar”, and especially coming from Susan Rice, it is incredibly rich.
The situation would be unsalvageable. Our national security and standing in the world, irreparably damaged.
I hope, but doubt shes’ right.
“The president praises Vladimir Putin and Kim Jong-un and thinks Xi Jinping, the leader of China, is the great leader to be emulated.”
Uh-huh.
The President who has bombed Russian airbases and killed Russian mercenaries in the Mid-East, has ramped up sanction on both Russia and China, is somehow pals with Putin and Pooh Bear?
She’s kinda right that our ‘Vid panic is embarrassing, but not for the reasons she implies.
And for Susan effing “Benghazi was about a YouTube video” Rice to lecture us about lying from the White House is a bit rich.
Correlation is not causation, of course, but it can be pretty suggestive.
Spurious Correlations says hi.
Also note with trying to correlate masking with cases: The “case count” curves are positive test results. There is proof of Lil Rona cases in Ohio and California long before the lockdowns started. There are doctors in Maine digging into old flu and respiratory illnesses to see if Lil Rona hit Maine in December.
I saw that… after I had been triggered by “can be pretty suggestive”.
I felt compelled to make a ranked list of sports by gayness. This is an official, complete list.
1. Soccer
2. Figure skating
3. Gymnastics
4. Tennis
5. WNBA
6. Cycling
Honorable mention to men’s wrestling. It’s not gay, but it’s homoerotic enough to where you have to keep a close eye on it.
2 is dependent on whether it’s male or female figure skating.
https://youtu.be/sNJmfuEWR8w
https://youtu.be/AuUwUi6gCU4
WRONG!
No one is going to take advice on how not to be gay from someone posting Depeche Mode links, pal.
I’ll leave it with this
Not too shabby.
My son plays club soccer. I would argue it is not gay. My wife had this idea of what soccer was about (from watching our younger kids play) and then my son started back up in high school. We were watching a match and he comes running down the touchline with another boy and they are grabbing and shoving, and elbowing each other like mad while running as fast as they could for a passed ball. I think my son even barreled into the crowd a bit. He’s pretty light, so he inevitably goes down in every match.
My wife was super surprised. They beat the shit out of each other as much as possible on the pitch.
There is a reason why players dive so often — it’s because there’s only one ref on the pitch, and if you make it look good, chances are you’ll get the call and at least get a free kick, which is a way to set your team up with a play for success.
Soccer is not gay. But diving like a sissy fairy is. When I played and was trying to draw a foul I actually drew a foul.
I agree with you, but I can understand why Neymar is out there rolling around all the time. It’s incentivized.
Any soccer player who hits the turf after contact with another player should immediately be sent to the medical facility for a thorough workup. For their own safety, of course.
I suspect that would be the end of “diving” in soccer matches.
yeah, basically american football injury rules. If you cause play to be stopped, you have to sit out until the next stoppage. If it’s bad enough to warrant using a substitution, fine. Otherwise you’re a man down until the whistle blows next.
Yep. And it’s very much a cultural thing – he was taught that from an early age. But you don’t good Protestants* doing it.
*said in Monty Python voice
I was traveling overseas, and some work acquaintances insist I watch the World Cup while I was there. I knew they would want to talk about it the next day, so I was like, what the hell. So I’m watching this flop fest, and a player on the other team goes down with a boo-boo on his butt. Instead of just walking it off, he stays laying on the ground and starts massaging his own ass in front of everybody. I mean, really going to town on it, too, with a big smile on his face. Eventually he got up, and was fine of course. That did it for me. I stopped watching, and flipped around channels until I found a rugby game as the perfect antidote.
Players flop all the time in basketball, but since it’s an American sport it doesn’t get called gay.
if a basketball player flops and nobody is there to see it, did they actually do it?
I’m sorry, but I will have to deny this argument. Competitive dance would be a less gay alternative. Suffice to say, competitive dance is not non-gay.
Replace gymnastics with diving. Male gymnasts probably get lots of chicks, if that’s what they are into.
can confirm (had a male gymnast roommate for a few years in college)
So do male cheerleaders. A friend was roommates with a male cheerleader one year in college and that dude never lacked for extremely attractive female company.
That’s just like your opinion, man.
And why would I even care?
I engaged in a highly scientific process to determine gayness. This is not opinion.
How can the WNBA be gay when there are no penes anywhere in the building when it happens?
First, there is still no scientific study that actually shows that masking reduces actual transmission.
I like that this study which I’ve seen used to support mandating masks a) used a damp washcloth and b) specifically states “We did not assess the relative roles of droplets generated during speech, droplet nuclei,2 and aerosols in the transmission of viruses.”.
Just like global warming. First, assume your hypothesis is correct. (Miniscule amounts of CO2 cause warming; COVID is transmitted primarily via droplets). Then measure inputs and model outputs as “proof.”
Masks also make people (feel) unaccountable.
I think this guy is still walking free.
I’m done reading your write up. I like it.
Gauleiterin Mills updates Lil Rona Panic guidance
For example, front-of-house staff in restaurants who choose to wear face shields must now wear them upside down so that they are attached at the collar instead of the forehead, so that their breath is directed up, not down.
Ahh. Choker Face Shields
“From now on, all citizens will be required to change their underwear every half hour. Underwear will be worn on the outside, so we can check!”
*Walks around with one of those chalk parking sticks, slapping people in the crotch*
What is that even for, and can you shoot someone for trying to vandalize your car with one?
They mark the tire with it so they can see if the car has been moved or not since the last time they saw it.
This has to be satire.
I doubt it. That’s Maine Public Radio.
Off topic: I’m shocked, shocked to find graft going on here!
I’m sure there are no actual problems faced by the black residents of Richmond where that $1.8 million would have been better served. They can all rest easy that huge pieces of iron no longer threaten them.
And lord knows the city is flush with cash and they don’t need these burdensome tourist attractions.
Without the Civil War, there is absolutely no reason for anyone to come here other than to visit family.
Bedroom community for NoVa? I know people who commute similar distances from PA to MD jobs.
$1.8 million to remove a statue?
That was a dandy contract.
The year continues to get stranger:
Budweiser wants to be Utah’s official state beer, suggests can with Delicate Arch and LDS temple .
What kind of ad campaign or ad company decided to sign off on this?
The Morman endorsement is vital for a beer company, dontchaknow.
I prefer Polygamy Porter. Why have just one?
That’s a great Porter,
Porter Rockwell?
Bring some home to the wives!
Fun aside:
I went to a Southern Baptist school. We had a shake-up in leadership and teachership my junior year that was kind of traumatic for all of us. My new physics teacher, though… Cue Van Halen. (To be fair, my brother thought he had a crush on me, too.)
Anyway, he had all sorts of ideas about how to fund scholarships and whatnot. They included soliciting funds from beer companies who were apparently eager to fund education. He made it sound so matter-of-fact, with the point being that you’re taking money from the “enemy” since it’s, you know, there to be taken.
My dad about had a coronary at the very idea of taking money from people whose products you are supposed to eschew. Hypocrisy! He also didn’t think the medical research the Nazis did should be made available because it was gotten evilly. (We’ve had this discussion before.)
Did your dad know that all alcohol sales fund Utah Public schools?
Likely not, but if he did, he would have lost his damned mind over it.
Not to be ragging on your pop. I found the juxtaposition odd myself. We fund schools by sales of stuff we tell kids at school they shouldn’t drink.
No, it’s okay. I think often about these things and mull them over. I can see his point. I can also see the opposite point.
Another drinking-related thing.
WKRP in Cincinnati. Gordon Jump was LDS and he was seen drinking “whisky”, but everybody knows they’re not drinking whisky; it’s apple juice. My dad felt he should not portray the drinking of whisky if he really believed in not drinking. I said, “He’s an actor. Why shouldn’t he do what the script calls for?” “Because he should be standing for his principles.”
I see his point, but as an artist, I can say that you are not portraying YOU. You are portraying SOMEONE ELSE, a someone else who may or may not have your sensibilities. How far do you go with that? How close do you hew to your own narrow set of beliefs? There are authors who won’t write people who swear. That’s fine. I think I remember Card saying he wouldn’t write anybody taking the Lord’s name in vain. I did that for a while, then realized that A LOT OF PEOPLE do, to the extent that we/I define it. I try to make each character speak as if what s/he is saying is natural to his/her personality, upbringing, situation, and circumstance.
So these are three things that he absolutely held a line of thought on that have stuck with me through the years. I don’t judge him one way or another on those things, but I do mull them over quite a bit.
So your father never noticed how he was in [unintentional but useful] political alliance with bootleggers?
Not quite sure what you mean about a political alliance, unless you’re assuming we lived in Utah, which we did not.
“Baptists and Bootleggers” was the title of a book that was about how factions that disagreed on things could mutually benefit from an oppressive state.
Thanks! I’ll have to check that out.
Allusion to “Baptists and Bootleggers“.
Article says they are commemorating the raise of the aclohol percentage from 3.5% to 5% last year.
Trump’s big pardon – Susan B. Anthony.
A complete let down.
If you go to NYT right now and search pardon…you will find nothing.
They did tweeter that “some say” she is problematic because race.
They really let the messaging get away from them. Everyon expected something big. not bullshit.
Still hasn’t freed Dred Scott, either.
Or Korematsu.
Where’s the street cred and the fun in civil disobedience if you get pardoned? If I were Susie B, I think I might be a bit peeved.
Here in no mask imposed Iowa retailers are the ones ‘requiring’ it.
I’ve adjusted my shopping accordingly switching to Hyvee and Fareway.
I’ve got something that’s about as thin as ladies nylons that I wear as a ‘mask’ for when I absolutely cannot avoid it.
If I can’t avoid the useless gesture, at least I can be comfortable.
School was initially making it optional, but Karening apparently turned it to mandatory, though they seem to not be too inclined to go all mask-nazi over it.
If they shut the schools down because someone gets a sniffle its home school time however.
Statewide the number of daily test has decreased from the peak 14 day average of 6100 per day to a 14 day average of 5000 per day since late July.
Likely because its winding down in the high population areas of the state.
In my part of the woods though its probably not anywhere near done yet.
Our county recently surpassed 500 per 100,000 confirmed cases so its still slow.
Its slow despite the town playing host to five different large outdoor gatherings in July.
A 4th of July parade and fireworks that evening, as well as four events on the square.
Indeed. The part aggravating me the most are the loudest maskholes shouting “science” are simultaneously wearing a piece of cotton over their faces. Oblivious to the fact the reason we wear cotton clothing is because it breathes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=almtH9kipl0
Then they also completely forget the government intentionally lied to them to keep people from hoarding the ones that actually do what they say they do.
There’s a hilarious late-nite infomercial about face masks with FOUR layers (NOT three!) and one of those layers is ELECTROSTATICALLY CHARGED! God bless America.
I plug my mask into a wall outlet.
I do love to see that. The fact that a whole mask industry sprung up overnight to take advantage of this silliness gives me hope for this country.
I think there’s also one that’s COPPER-INFUSED!!
That one was satire, cool YT channel
I dunno about YT but there is a real one, from the same company that does all the copper belts and socks and the like.
Or, I could look one post down. 🙂
*tugs at collar and looks around nervously*
https://www.coppercompression.com/products/copper-infused-face-mask/
Tell whoever you see with those on this fun fact: you can eliminate the spread of virus encapsulated aerosols by tying a plastic bag over your head.
Infuse the fabric with radium and the radiation will kill the nasties before they get to your lungs. Only $36.00 per dozen.
Taibbi throws down!
Reminds me of that Onion TV bit where the commentators are able to see live polling of their popularity.
I’ve seen a lot of unhinged/retarded mailbox conspiracy horseshit being thrown around lately. Was Jamie Lee Curtis’ moronic tweet about the mail truck being stolen the genesis of this craziness or was she just part of a larger trend?
I think just a part. Trump be stealin the mailboxes is the newest perfidy.
I think that sort of thing was happening every day, but nobody noticed until now. Personally, I haven’t used a public mail box in probably 30 years. I just put mail in own mail box. The one exception was when I had something time sensitive that had to be mailed right away. For those things, I drove to the post office. Every post office I’ve ever been to has a whole row of mail boxes in the parking lot. Why can’t people use those?
Look, they need those boxes to cheat in the election, so oooooobviioouuussllllyyy Trump is going to try to get rid of the boxes. It’s like, simple logic, dude.
I like the Scott Adams theory. They expect to lose, so they’re setting the table for declaring the election invalid, that way they can forcibly remove him later. It’s the same reason you’re seeing all the “what if Trump refuses to leave office” stories.
There are people who will call that a “baseless conspiracy theory” without a trace of self-awareness.
Of course, and that’s exactly why you’re already hearing noise about Trump declaring the election invalid and not leaving office. It’s a long standing pattern. Whatever they have done or are planning to do, they accuse the other side of doing.
So why the mailboxes, specifically? Because they plan on cheating with those mailboxes.
It may be 1 Billlion Degrees in AZ, but we still have drive thru liquor stores, 30 pack of TALLCANS! and a carton of smokes, All set for a hot Sunday afternoon
Oscar’s has gotten on board the bandwagon: https://www.newyorkupstate.com/food/2020/08/you-can-get-bacon-in-a-vending-machine-at-an-upstate-ny-smokehouse.html
The village I live in is trying to pass an unconstitutional mandatory mask law that includes wearing masks when you’re at your house and you have company, and in your car with any other person.
The law includes a $250 fine for the first offence and $500 for all subsequent offences.
Happily the cops and the town judge have all told me privately they think it’s bullshit. The cops won’t enforce it.
Even some of the extremely liberal residents are up in arms.
This is being pushed heavily by our incompetent mayor, who is also trying to force all restaurants to have a 12’ radius around every table.
“First, was the hope that the SARS-2 virus would not be heat tolerant, and would go away in the summer. This has turned out not to be the case.”
It’s a normal curve. Hope-Simpson FTW.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ia8D7Gnq0TE