Stoic Friday XLI

by | Oct 27, 2023 | Advice, LifeSkills, Musings | 102 comments

Last Week

Meditations

How to Be a Stoic

How to Think Like a Roman Emperor

Seneca’s Letters from a Stoic

If you have anger issues, this one is a great tool (h/t mindyourbusiness)

This week’s book:

Discourses and Selected Writings

Disclaimer: I’m not your Supervisor. These are my opinions after reading through these books a few times.

Epictetus was born a slave around 50 ad. His owner was Epaphroditus, a rich freedman who was once a slave of Nero. Though he was a slave Epictetus was sent to study philosophy under Musonius Rufus.

Epictetus was lame and there are some stories it was caused by his master and others that it was caused by disease.

He was a freedman when all philosophers were banished from Rome in 89 by the Emperor Domitian. He then started his school in Greece, and had many students. He did not leave any writings from his lessons, but one of his students, Flavius Arrian, took notes and wrote the Discourses.

Epictetus did not marry, had no children, and lived to be around 80-85. In retirement, he adopted a child that would have been abandoned and raised him with a woman.

He died sometime around AD 135.

He might be my favorite Stoic teacher. I love his bare bones and very straight forward approach.

Following is a paragraph-by-paragraph discussion of one of his lessons. Epictetus’s text appears in bold, my replies are in normal text.

THAT CONFIDENCE DOES NOT CONFLICT WITH CAUTION

Perhaps the following contention of the philosophers appears paradoxical to some, but nevertheless let us to the best of our ability consider whether it is true that “we ought to do everything both cautiously and confidently at the same time.” For caution seems to be in a way contrary to confidence, and contraries are by no means consistent. But that which appears to many to be paradoxical in the matter under discussion seems to me to involve something of this sort: If we demanded that a man should employ both caution and confidence in regard to the same things, then we would be justly charged with uniting qualities that are not to be united. But, as a matter of fact, what is there strange about the saying? For if the statements which have often been made and often proved are sound, namely that “the nature of the good as well as of the evil lies in a use of the impressions of the senses, but the things which lie outside the province of the moral purpose admit neither the nature of the evil, nor the nature of the good”;

In the way good or evil of decisions lie with our reasoned choices and outside of that is neither, so should there be confidence and caution behind our decisions and actions. It is somewhat of a paradox to employ both thoughts at once but it can help prevent over boldness and paralysis caused by fear if I can master both.

5what is there paradoxical about the contention of the philosophers, if they say, “Where the things that lie outside the province of the moral purpose are involved, there show confidence, but where the things that lie within the province of the moral purpose are involved, there show caution”? For if the evil lies in an evil exercise of the moral purpose, it is only in regard to matters of this kind that it is right to employ caution; but if the things which lie outside the province of the moral purpose and are not under our control are nothing to us, we ought to employ confidence in regard to them. And so we shall be at one and the same time both cautious and confident, yes, and, by Zeus, confident because of our caution. For because we are cautious about the things which are really evil, the result will be that we shall have confidence in regard to the things which are not of that nature.

If I see there is nothing in my control and understand the outcome is not up to me, then there is no reason for caution. I need to instill this in myself as I try to get a side hustle up and running. I have been hesitant to apply for many openings because I talk myself out of it. I have managed to convince myself that no one will hire me because I have no experience instead of just applying and seeing what happens. If I remind myself of this, it will help me to be more bold.

However, we act like deer: when the hinds are frightened by the feathers[1] and run away from them, where do they turn, and to what do they fly for refuge as a safe retreat? Why, to the nets; and so they perish because they have confused the objects of fear with the objects of confidence. So it is with us also; where do we show fear? About the things which lie outside the province of the moral purpose. Again, in what do we behave with confidence as if there were no danger? In the things which lie within the province of the moral purpose.

I am sure that I have been confident in myself in regards to my internal choices (the one thing I really control) and should have been more introspective. Tonight, I got mad at my puppy. In the moment, it felt like a good decision, but as soon as I thought about it, I realized it was pointless. He didn’t understand why I snapped at him, it definitely didn’t help him with learning proper behavior, and it made me feel foolish. Sometimes more caution is warranted before I act.

10To be deceived, or to act impetuously, or to do something shameless, or with base passion to desire something, makes no difference to us, if only in the matters which lie outside the province of the will we succeed in our aim. But where death, or exile, or hardship, or ignominy faces us, there we show the spirit of running away, there we show violent agitation. Therefore, as might be expected of those men who err in matters of the greatest concern, we transform our natural confidence into boldness, desperateness, recklessness, shamelessness, while our natural caution and self-respect we transform into cowardice and abjectness, full of fears and perturbations. For if a man should transfer his caution to the sphere of the moral purpose and the deeds of the moral purpose, then along with the desire to be cautious he will also at once have under his control the will to avoid; whereas, if he should transfer his caution to those matters which are not under our control and lie outside the province of the moral purpose, inasmuch as he is applying his will to avoid towards those things which are under the control of others, he will necessarily be subject to fear, instability, and perturbation. For it is not death or hardship that is a fearful thing, but the fear of hardship or death. That is why we praise the man who said

Not death is dreadful, but a shameful death.[2]

Our confidence ought, therefore, to be turned toward death, and our caution toward the fear of death; whereas we do just the opposite—in the face of death we turn to flight, but about the formation of a judgement on death we show carelessness, disregard, and unconcern.

As long as I can be confident in the face of hardship, knowing that I don’t control it, and use caution in matters of self control, I will have a better handle on my reactions and less self induced stress.

But 15Socrates did well to call all such things “bugbears.”[3] For just as masks appear fearful and terrible to children because of inexperience, in some such manner we also are affected by events, and this for the same reason that children are affected by bugbears. For what is a child? Ignorance. What is a child? Want of instruction. For where a child has knowledge, he is no worse than we are. What is death? A bugbear. Turn it about and learn what it is; see, it does not bite. The paltry body must be separated from the bit of spirit, either now or later, just as it existed apart from it before. Why are you grieved, then, if it be separated now? For if it be not separated now, it will be later. Why? So that the revolution of the universe may be accomplished;[4] for it has need of the things that are now coming into being, and the things that shall be, and the things that have been accomplished. What is hardship? A bugbear. Turn it about and learn what it is. The poor flesh is subjected to rough treatment, and then again to smooth. If you do not find this profitable, the door stands open; if you do find it profitable, bear it.

External forces are “bugbears”. I like that name, it seems to fit something that can only really stress me out if I let it. When I have a conflict, I need to be able to see if it is a real thing for me or just a “bugbear”.

20For the door must be standing open for every emergency, and then we have no trouble.

What, then, is the fruit of these doctrines? Precisely that which must needs be both the fairest and the most becoming for those who are being truly educated—tranquillity, fearlessness, freedom. For on these matters we should not trust the multitude, who say, “Only the free can be educated,” but rather the philosophers, who say, “Only the educated are free.”—How is that?—Thus: At this time[5] is freedom anything but the right to live as we wish? “Nothing else.” Tell me, then, O men, do you wish to live in error? “We do not.” Well, no one who lives in error is free. Do you wish to live in fear, in sorrow, in turmoil? “By no means.” Well then, no man who is in fear, or sorrow, or turmoil, is free, but whoever is rid of sorrows and fears and turmoils, this man is by the self-same course rid also of slavery.

If I can understand and follow Stoicism, I will be free of external stress. I am still a work in progress, but if I think back to my mentality before I started getting deeper into this philosophy it is like looking at a 5 year old throwing a tantrum because I couldn’t get ice cream. I still slip up, but I have so much freedom from anger and stress that I am a different person. My wife has noticed and at work it has been said that nothing bothers me.

25How, then, shall we any longer trust you, O dearest lawgivers? Do we allow none but the free to get an education? For the philosophers say, “We do not allow any but the educated to be free”; that is, God does not allow it.—When, therefore, in the presence of the praetor a man turns his own slave about, has he done nothing?[6]—He has done something.—What?—He has turned his slave about in the presence of the praetor,—Nothing more?—Yes, he is bound to pay a tax of five per cent, of the slave’s value.—What then? Has not the man to whom this has been done become free?—He has no more become free than he has acquired peace of mind. You, for example, who are able to turn others about, have you no master? Have you not as your master money, or a mistress, or a boy favorite, or the tyrant, or some friend of the tyrant? If not, why do you tremble when you go to face some circumstance involving those things?

Slavery to external forces is still slavery. Even slave holders had their problems, and a lot of them were brought on by external forces.

That is why I say over and over again, “Practice these things and have them ready at hand, that is, the knowledge of what you ought to face with confidence, and what you ought to face with caution—that you ought to face with confidence that which is outside the province of the moral purpose, with caution that which is within the province of the moral purpose.”

This goes back to the base of Stoicism, that some things are under my control and everything else is not. If I can clearly identify which is which and act accordingly, then I will truly be free, regardless of my external circumstances.

30—But have I not read to you, and do you not know what I am doing?[7]—What have you been engaged upon? Trifling phrases! Keep your trifling phrases! Show me rather how you stand in regard to desire and aversion, whether you do not fail to get what you wish, or do not fall into what you do not wish. As for those trifling periods of yours, if you are wise, you will take them away somewhere and blot them out.—What then? Did not Socrates write?—Yes, who wrote as much as he?[8] But how? Since he could not have always at hand someone to test his judgements, or to be tested by him in turn, he was in the habit of testing and examining himself, and was always in a practical way trying out some particular primary conception. That is what a philosopher writes; but trifling phrases, and “said he,” “said I”[9][† 1] he leaves to others, to the stupid or the blessed, those who by virtue of their tranquillity live at leisure, or those who by virtue of their folly take no account of logical conclusions.

Here Epictetus is critiquing an essay from a student and is obviously unimpressed by the pretty language used. Instead of being a flowery writer, it is more important to have a strong grasp of the concept so when tested by life, I can look at it correctly and decide a course of action accordingly.

And now, when the crisis calls, will you go off and make an exhibition of your compositions, and give a reading from them, and boast, “See, how I write dialogues”? 35Do not so, man, but rather boast as follows: “See how in my desire I do not fail to get what I wish. See how in my aversions I do not fall into things that I would avoid. Bring on death and you shall know; bring on hardships, bring on imprisonment, bring on disrepute, bring on condemnation.” This is the proper exhibition of a young man come from school. Leave other things to other people; neither let anyone ever hear a word from you about them, nor, if anyone praises you for them, do you tolerate it, but let yourself be accounted a no-body and a know-nothing. Show that you know this only—how you may never either fail to get what you desire or fall into what you avoid. Let others practise lawsuits, others problems, others syllogisms; do you practise how to die, how to be enchained, how to be racked, how to be exiled. Do all these things with confidence, with trust in Him who has called you to face them and deemed you worthy of this position, in which having once been placed you shall exhibit what can be achieved by a rational governing principle when arrayed against the forces that lie outside the province of the moral purpose.

When fortune goes against me, being able to quote philosophers and break down their concepts won’t serve me unless I can actually put the ideas into practice.

40And thus the paradox of which we were speaking will no longer appear either impossible or paradoxical, namely, that at the same time we ought to be both cautious and confident, confident in regard to those things that lie outside the province of the moral purpose, and cautious in regard to those things that lie within the province of the moral purpose.

I will use this passage the next time I am looking for freelance work to remind me to act with boldness and not feel like a failure when I am not getting a lot of attention. Once I get a gig, then I can use that experience to land others, but if I don’t work hard to get that first gig because of a sense of caution holding me back, then I am just making it harder on myself.

 

Music this week is from Somewhere in Time.

While it is not one of my real favorites from them, it does have some real strong tracks like most of their albums.

Wasted Years  little mellow, but still cool.

Stranger in a Strange Land I always liked this one, and it got me to read the book from Heinlein which I liked even though it was the wrong story. It was good until the Martian became a preacher IMO.

Alexander the Great One of my favorites from this album.

About The Author

ron73440

ron73440

What I told my wife when she said my steel Baby Eagle .45 was heavy, "Heavy is good, heavy is reliable, if it doesn't work you could always hit him with it."-Boris the Blade MOLON LABE

102 Comments

  1. Fourscore

    Thanks ron, Sometimes when we make a decision because of cautiousness it really is based on confidence that we may be in over our heads. We just need more practice at success to realize that failure is also a learning tool.

    • Fourscore

      When all else fails there’s always politics to turn to.

      • ron73440

        Politics and news, too depressing to worry much about.

        If it wasn’t for this website, I wouldn’t know anything going on in the world.

  2. juris imprudent

    So I’m nearly through the Genealogy of Morals and about to dig into Twilight of the Idols* (and had previously completed my first read of Thus Spoke Zarathustra – which requires more than one pass through it); that means I’ll probably be dropping an article or two on Nietzsche on ya’ll. May even do one on his ideas in context of his life.

    * subtitled How to philosophize with a hammer. The man had a unique sense of humor.

    • UnCivilServant

      Hammers are great conversationalists.

      Just don’t get on the subject of nails.

      • Dr. Fronkensteen

        When all you are is a hammer, every conversation is about nails.

      • UnCivilServant

        Cosmetology is a demanding calling.

      • ron73440

        My wife, who rarely wears fake nails and when she does, they look like normal fingernails and not claws, lost a nail in the pizza dough last week.

        I told her in a real restaurant she could be fired for that.

        She became disappointed when I told her I couldn’t fire her because I could not afford to replace her.

      • UnCivilServant

        You know, that wouldn’t have happened if she were wearing cooking gloves.

        😛

      • ron73440

        That’s funny, but she has clear plastic gloves, I’ll have to make sure she wears them next time to prevent me from having to write her up again.

    • ron73440

      Never read any Nietzsche, but what I have heard sounds interesting.

  3. The Late P Brooks

    We just need more practice at success to realize that failure is also a learning tool.

    You can learn more from failure than from success.

    *if you’re smart

  4. DEG

    Thanks Ron.

    External forces are “bugbears”. I like that name, it seems to fit something that can only really stress me out if I let it. When I have a conflict, I need to be able to see if it is a real thing for me or just a “bugbear”.

    I picture the D&D critter.

    • ron73440

      The D&D critter actually looks scary, so using that mental image might defeat the purpose.

  5. The Late P Brooks

    Dazzling insight

    Cooperman criticized the pro-Palestinian protests held by Columbia students while speaking on Fox Business’s The Claman Countdown on Wednesday, saying he thinks college students “have sh** for brains.”

    None of the preceding idiocy clued you in?

    • R.J.

      Another positive development. Cut off the leftists!

    • The Other Kevin

      I’ve been thinking of a way to articulate this lately, and right now I think it has to do with “luxury beliefs”. As in, you can tolerate or encourage all the woke crap as long as it doesn’t affect you. But when your aunt in Israel gets raped and murdered, that’s a different story.

      • kinnath

        “luxury beliefs”

        When you’re not worried about how to pay for your next meal or to pay for clothing and shelter or to get around from place to place . . . . then you can waste your time worrying about trivialities.

      • The Other Kevin

        There was an article written about it not too long ago. More along the lines of, if you live in an expensive gated community you can afford to believe in defunding the police. As for the college kids, they can afford to support Palestine because Hamas isn’t going to show up at one of their parties to behead them or throw them off a building for being trans.

      • creech

        In 1941, most college students opposed the Nazis and Japs even when they realized those thugs wouldn’t be showing up at their frat parties. Except for a few pinkos and reds, that generation of students largely knew the difference betweeñ good and evil.

    • JaimeRoberto (carnitas/spicy salsa)

      People live in their own bubbles and don’t really pay attention until something like this breaks through.

    • mindyourbusiness

      Cooperman graduated in 1967; likely he thought of Columbia as still teaching a balanced view of knowledge, based on fact rather than ideology.
      I can’t entirely fault the kids. They’re immersed in wokeness from the minute they step on campus to the day they graduate. Many of them have little real-world experience and are prone to accepting what they learn uncritically. But the faculties and administrations deserve the largest share of the blame – and shame.

      • The Other Kevin

        I went to college in the early 90’s, and the closest I came to woke was sociology 101. I think sociology was the starting point for all this “deconstruction” bullshit. But yeah, I can’t imagine what it would be like for a student where they’re away from home and every single teacher and person of authority is telling you the same thing day after day.

    • Urthona

      It’s funny to me that *this* is what finally convinced them.

  6. R.J.

    I have the uncut version of Stranger in a Strange Land on my shelf. I have yet to read it.

    • UnCivilServant

      I didn’t know they still sold books like that. Normally the printers trim the signatures before shipping.

    • ron73440

      I found it to be really interesting, for the first half anyway.

      • robc

        Yes, and the 2nd half is unreadable crap.

      • kinnath

        I read it 50 years ago. I remember the basic story outline, but not much else.

      • creech

        👍

    • Nephilium

      I’m a fan, but then again I’ve enjoyed nearly all the Heinlein I’ve read.

      • UnCivilServant

        He’s still the only author I’ve chucked against the wall with great force.

    • Fatty Bolger

      Have you read the original version?

    • The Last American Hero

      Easy read once you get the foreskin out of the way.

    • The Other Kevin

      “Driving the transformation has been a relentless stream of layoffs, resignations and policy reversals, as well as messy product rollouts and unfulfilled promises.”
      I log on every day and this is the opposite of my experience.

      • JaimeRoberto (carnitas/spicy salsa)

        I’ve noticed very little difference. Community Notes has been big improvement. The name change is weird, but doesn’t impact anything. Reliability seems about the same. The only thing that has gotten worse in my opinion is that now I get a lot of like from women looking for dates. Maybe they truly appreciate my witty comments, but somehow I doubt their sincerity.

      • Fatty Bolger

        I do too, and it’s gone from being stagnant to having steady feature improvements. Performance is about the same. However, behind the scenes they have been making massive changes to increase efficiency and dramatically cut operating expenses.

  7. The Late P Brooks

    I read Stranger in a Strange Land in high school. Don’t remember much about it.

  8. ron73440

    I keep getting the internal service error.

    • UnCivilServant

      Have you tried the external services?

      • R.J.

        No, no. That’s not the right advice. Have you turned it of and on again?

      • ron73440

        No, but I did check the thermostat and now it seems to be working.

  9. The Late P Brooks

    Walking around money

    JPMorgan Chase & Co. Chief Executive Officer Jamie Dimon plans to sell shares currently worth about $141 million, the first such transaction since he took the helm at the Wall Street giant almost 18 years ago.

    Starting next year, Dimon and his family will dispose of 1 million of the lender’s shares for financial diversification and tax-planning purposes, according to a regulatory filing Friday. JPMorgan shares closed at $140.76 in New York on Thursday.

    Dimon “continues to believe the company’s prospects are very strong and his stake in the company will remain very significant,” JPMorgan said in the statement. The planned transaction, which is subject to the terms of the bank’s stock-trading plan, would be the CEO’s “first such stock sale during his tenure at the company.”

    The increase of almost 250% in JPMorgan’s shares during Dimon’s tenure — more than 10 times the gain in the S&P 500 Financials Index — has helped turn the executive into a billionaire. In early 2009, Dimon bought 500,000 shares in the bank as a sign of confidence amid a stock slump. He made an identical move in 2016, spending about $38 million on the two rounds of purchases.

    Dimon and his family currently hold about 8.6 million JPMorgan shares, meaning the planned sale would represent less than 12% of their holdings in the New York-based bank. His net worth totals about $2 billion, according to the Bloomberg Billionaires Index.

    You never know when you might see a nice yacht with a For Sale sign on it.

  10. The Late P Brooks

    Wells Fargo & Co. analyst Mike Mayo noted that Dimon’s stock-sale plan “comes after his bearish comments that include the possibility of interest rates increasing to 7%, and an ‘uninvestable’ banking sector” due to the burden of proposed Basel III Endgame requirements.

    It’ll be fine.

    • UnCivilServant

      Which Pele? The volcano god? the soccer player?

      • robc

        I thought the soccer player was the volcano god?

      • Nephilium

        What about his island in the lake?

  11. Sean

    Work PC upgraded.
    <===

    • CPRM

      Hopefully is has a mechanical power button instead of a button on a PCB. I’m not having luck with the latter recently.

      • R.J.

        My home PC has a big mechanical switch to turn internet access on and off. It’s boss.

  12. The Late P Brooks

    From Jaime’s link:

    Twelve months on, the company barely resembles its former self — and not only because Musk renamed it “X” and did away with its iconic blue bird branding. Through a dizzying and haphazard barrage of changes, Musk has transformed a profitable company once regarded as the world’s go-to source for breaking news and political commentary into a widely ridiculed platform that’s fighting just to break even and crippled by debt; that’s struggling to manage spam and disinformation; that’s alienated some of its biggest advertisers and users; and that’s casting about for purpose.

    “He ruined our sandbox! Now anybody can just come in and kick sand on us. Not fair!”

    • ron73440

      Widely ridiculed. by who?

      • R.J.

        That article was completely divorced from reality. I assume this was a hit piece paid for by Fartbook or Biden’s disinformation wonks.

      • Fourscore

        At least the other guy didn’t manage disinformation.

    • JaimeRoberto (carnitas/spicy salsa)

      “Musk has transformed a profitable company”. Not true. Twitter was not profitable.

      • The Last American Hero

        If HRC had won in2016, Twitter would have been bankrupt by 2018.

      • R.J.

        “Musk has transformed X INTO a profitable company”
        There I fixed it.

  13. Sean

    Man, Mopar *really* wants to sell me an extended warranty on a new vehicle purchased 4 months ago. It’s getting a bit obnoxious how many emails they’ve sent me. 🙄

    • R.J.

      Ick! I do not get such things.

    • The Last American Hero

      It’s a Mopar and you didn’t shell out for the extended warranty?

      • R.J.

        HIM HAVE STEVE SMITH WARRANTY.
        CAR BREAK DOWN, STEVE SMITH RAPE MOPAR SALESMEN.
        HIM NOT HAVE A WARRANTY CLAIM YET IN TEN YEARS.

      • Sean

        I mean, I *might*, but I surely don’t need it yet.

    • DrOtto

      Let me help you decide – Stellantis, formerly Chrysler-Fiat. Yes that Fiat.

      • kinnath

        I don’t need to buy their extended warranty, because I refuse to buy their products.

      • Stinky Wizzleteats

        Fiat, the only company who could acquire Chrysler/Dodge and make the overall quality worse. Hopefully Sean has good luck with his but an extended warranty might not hurt.

    • Fourscore

      Only those protecting Kennedy should have guns because he’s special.

  14. The Late P Brooks

    X is now facing perhaps its biggest test yet under new ownership amid the ongoing Israel-Hamas war — and numerous tech watchdogs and civil society groups have raised alarms about false claims and propaganda linked to the conflict on the platform. And as next year’s elections in the United States and elsewhere raise fears about the further spread of misinformation campaigns, X’s value to the public conversation appears increasingly in doubt.

    Wrongthink by those who should be unpersoned. How will “civil society” prevail?

    That “civil society groups” whimwham really gets under my skin. Censorious ideologues in a frilly dress.

    • The Other Kevin

      I agree with them about about the false claims and propaganda. Why just last week a bunch of accounts from “news” sites were spreading false claims and propaganda about Israel bombing a hospital and killing 500 people.

    • R.J.

      No shit. When mainstream media repeats Palestinian lies over and over again, and X has debunked those rumors days ago – who is guilty here?

      • The Other Kevin

        The most damning thing I’ve seen as far as disinformation is one of those compilation videos of the MSM, Fauci, Birx, and Biden saying over and over: “If you take the shot you won’t get COVID. The virus just STOPS. You won’t get sick.” And then it shows that each of them got COVID after getting the vax, Biden getting it twice.

      • R.J.

        i think ZeroHedge or PJ Media published an article with thirty links to debunked narratives pushed by major networks. It was stunning. Endless lies….

      • ron73440

        Stephen Crowder did one show where he went through a lot of the lies told by the “experts”.

        He showed them saying something and then showed them saying the opposite or showed where they were lying.

        YouTube took it down for…you guessed it…misinformation.

  15. R.J.

    “If I can understand and follow Stoicism, I will be free of external stress. I am still a work in progress, but if I think back to my mentality before I started getting deeper into this philosophy it is like looking at a 5 year old throwing a tantrum because I couldn’t get ice cream. I still slip up, but I have so much freedom from anger and stress that I am a different person. My wife has noticed and at work it has been said that nothing bothers me.”

    ^This. Nobody is perfect. But we can all do better.

      • kinnath

        Another excellent choice

      • Fatty Bolger

        I just watched that for the first time a few months ago. It was really good.

      • ron73440

        I liked it pretty well, but I do remember thinking it was getting dumb right before the bus fight.

        Overall, it was good.

    • CPRM

      I find that (legal) drugs and alcohol help.

  16. The Late P Brooks

    I wonder if this will change his view on gun control.

    Was the intruder attempting to inject him with an unknown substance?

    He’ll probably just whine about not having a Secret Service detail. Only vetted, trained professionals, blah blah blah…

  17. The Late P Brooks

    It’s a Mopar and you didn’t shell out for the extended warranty?

    That’s pretty much what I was thinking.

  18. The Late P Brooks

    The most damning thing I’ve seen as far as disinformation is one of those compilation videos of the MSM, Fauci, Birx, and Biden saying over and over: “If you take the shot you won’t get COVID. The virus just STOPS. You won’t get sick.” And then it shows that each of them got COVID after getting the vax, Biden getting it twice.

    I don’t watch much of that sort of stuff, but there was one (linked here, no doubt) which featured a long string of mainstream media talking heads saying the same things over and over verbatim. You know, as if they had all been given the exact same script.

    • ron73440

      THAT’S DANGEROUS FOR OUR DEMOCRACY!

    • The Other Kevin

      Rush Limbaugh caught onto that years ago. The earliest one I remember is when GWB chose Dick Cheney to be his running mate. And they all said it added a sense of “gravitas”. Who the hell uses that word? And yet there was a long string of them saying that same word, over and over, within the same week.

    • Fatty Bolger

      They quickly and ruthlessly shot the NPC meme down for a reason.

  19. prolefeed

    From the dead thread, about the cognitive differences caused by language filters:

    “thrakkorzog on October 27, 2023 at 9:50 am

    I think color is a better example. It’s fairly common to lump in red and orange or blue and green together in a number of languages.
    That doesn’t mean that people who speak those languages can’t see the differences, but it does make it harder for them to spot the differences and then articulate them.
    A feeling familiar to many guys stuck trying to help pick out paint colors.”

    The fact that English tries to buttonhole colors with simple names like red or orange or yellow is a filter itself. It picks a handful of somewhat arbitrary points on a continuous spectrum and obscures that there is a spectrum.

    For example, I paint with acrylics. By my count, I have 26 different colors of paint with at least a hint of green in them, ranging from colors that most people would label as yellow, such as florescent chartreuse or a custom mixed jar of (pastel green gold and light green (blue shade)), to colors that most people would label blue, such as teal, turquoise, or a custom mixed jar of pastel phtalo blue (green shade).

    And that’s before I smear these color lines by taking, say, magenta and adding yellow orange a drop at a time to get a dozen intermediate shades.

    • The Other Kevin

      I took a color theory class in college, and we spent a lot of time on the color wheel. We also worked in acrylic. To make “pure” blue on the color wheel we had to mix two different blues together.

      • Gender Traitor

        In first year “Visual Fundamentals,” we had to construct color wheels/ color spectrum charts by finding sufficiently large samples in the mountain of already-chopped-up magazines. It was a ruthless, dog-eat-dog business.

      • Gender Traitor

        ::lights MikeS signal::

      • Mojeaux

        Right?!

    • Gender Traitor

      + > 15,000 Pantone colors

      • kinnath

        Pantone matching system

        Nightmares from my printing days.

      • Nephilium

        No one needs that many colors. I mean the SRM scale doesn’t go that high.