A cadre of fighting men, abandoned by their government to four years of prison camps and Marxist indoctrination, followed by a release back into a society that neither knows nor cares about them. Then those same men being recruited to fight a terrorist insurgency in another part of the world while being given free rein as to how to recruit troops and, more importantly, how to fight this new sort of enemy. An enemy that uses civilian targets and human shields, indeed, uses the whole of the people to fight its battles.
A woman, living with a man who doesn’t love her, in abandoned houses that her government doesn’t care for, among people who don’t respect her for what she does, but only for what she can do for them. And these circumstances draw her closer and closer to actions from which there is no return.
Now, imagine all of those people, their hopes and dreams, their need for both life and respect. How they have been shown the hatred and disdain of the ruling class, the indifference of the people around them, a changing world that leaves their ideals behind, and a chance to make a difference in how the world perceives both people suffering at the hands of others and the best ways to deal with a faceless enemy.
The Centurions, by Jean Larteguy, was published in 1960, only a few years after the fall of Dien Bien Phu, where the fabled Para’s of the French army had been abandoned by their government and left in Viet Minh prison camps, but during the middle of the Algerian conflict, which was rapidly spilling into the lives of the French middle class. The author speaks with authority, being a former paratrooper with the Free French Army of WWII and later a war correspondent before becoming a novelist. He saw firsthand how an enemy can be elusive, encompassing both civilians and uniformed troops. And how war is a totaling experience, involving every aspect of life for the combatants. The book reads as a series of anecdotes, unsurprising coming from a former journalist, and while there is a tendency to tell and not show, it is to be forgiven due to the subject matter. We see many characters, whose French names often make them difficult to tell apart, but each is given as a means to tell the story from as many parts of Gallic society as possible. Men, for it is always men, who do not fit into much of the modern world, finding like-minded individuals and working together to solve a problem that said modern world doesn’t really want to solve, at least not in a way that works.
The Good Terrorist, by Dorris Lessing, looks at the same problem, but from the other side of the equation; the people who are being crushed by those same world leaders in the headlong rush to globalization, and the steps they take to stop this. In their eyes, what they are doing is absolutely correct, as far as ideology goes, for they see the government that is supposed to rule over them as having lost all sense of legitimacy in the face of its many atrocities, Or at the very least, its unfitness due to being a conquering power. This is the tale of Alice, a drifter who lives in the main by sponging off of her middle-class parents while living in a London squat. She shows her skills to her co-inhabitants by getting the water and power turned back on and transforming the disgusting abandoned house into a livable home, but later gets drawn by her fellow residents into activities that, while seemingly in support of her growing need to challenge normie culture and values, but later turn out to be immensely destructive.
Lessing grew up in what became Southern Rhodesia, notorious for being a British colony with brutal methods of crushing native culture and rights. She was an anti-nuclear war activist and member of the British Communist Party, leaving only in 1956 after the failed Hungarian uprising. In other words, she is speaking from experience. Her writing here is crisp and styled in a much more naturalistic way, which is no surprise due to the fact she is a Nobel-prize-winning author of great distinction. One of the greatest achievements of this book is that one is never sure if it is satirical, dead honest, or a work of comedy.
These two books cover the ideas of modern warfare, the hell that it encompasses, the perceived need for its struggles, along with the idiocy of its movements, from both sides. When looked at as a pair, the two tales bookend the idea of the struggle for independence in the post-colonial era, how these battles are all-encompassing and do not adhere to the concepts of war in the Western, United Nations ideal. It is very easy to pick a side, depending on one’s priors, as the way the two groups are presented will trigger many emotions about the place and needs of the government and it’s actors in society.
In both books, none of the main characters are presented as either good or evil, but simply as people informed by their life experiences and acting with those thoughts at the forefront of their beliefs. They might or might not be rational to outsiders, but within that smallest possible place, their own minds, they are doing what they feel is the best they can with the limited information they have.
*****************************************
Right now we are watching a momentous occurrence of a similar nature in the Israeli-Hamas conflict. There is strong support for Israel, while many clearly favor Hamas. Is this support anti-Semitism, or a push for ethnic cleansing? Is Hamas a conquered people rising up against their jailors, as is the right of any oppressed group? Is Israel right in going in to completely crush Hamas, casualties be damned? Or we can look at it from the lens of the protests on January 6th, 2020. Were they free people speaking up against the injustices of a government that purports to subservient to them? Or, as others view them, insurrectionists who failed to take over that same government? We see both views on an almost daily basis, and only the politics of the view determines which view is right, and which is wrong.
All of that to say, much as these novels say, that the only right answer is to win and write the history, or to not play at all, and accept fate.
The Centurions, 1960, by Jean Larteguy; The Good Terrorist, 1985, by Dorris Lessing.
Blast from the past – I seem to remember reading The Good Terrorist back in high school.
Is Israel right in going in to completely crush Hamas, casualties be damned?
YES
I doubt it. Probably the smartest thing to do, aside from killing as much of the leadership as possible, is to force new elections in Gaza. If Gazans vote for Hamas then they are signalling they want to die, and that’s their choice. I would assume that if given a chance to freely elect a new govt, they would choose more wisely – but I’m very likely wrong about that.
We’re often told that Arabic people’s respect only strength. If that’s true, in a new election, what group or leader looks “strong”?
Right now, Hamas is being cheered and celebrated, so my guess is that they’d be elected again.
Same logic employed by Al Qaeda when they bomb civilian targets.
Yep, it’s a bad road to go down.
^we have a winner
False dichotomy – you either try to go to war without any regard to civilian casualties, or you let terrorists attack you without any retaliation.
The Israeli government having mostly rational actors, they are acutely aware that if they lose the support of the U.S. government by committing atrocities, they’re likely to get banned from buying or receiving arms from the U.S., and will get crushed by their enemies.
It’s weird then how only the Americans believed the insane lie that Israel never bombed a hospital, just a week before we all started saying how actually bombing hospitals is good, because make believe tunnels.
Your argument is quickly disproven by reality
They’ll never lose support from the US because Americans are ridiculously propagandized on the conflict. There are mentally challenged Americans who compare Hezbolah to ISIS, even those those two groups kill each other in Syria.
The fact that Israel was selling weapons to Azerbaijan to help genocide Christian Armenians just before this war and the fact that this is largely unknown among the American population is a clear cut example of propagandized news. How often are the complaints of the Christian patriarchs in Israel ever mentioned in the US? The Anglicans managed the first hospital Israel bombed and they dispute that there were any militants. Has that been broadcast anywhere in the US?
The flippant blood lust is embarrassing
Wait, are you still pretending that Hamas’s lie about Israel bombing a hospital and killing 500 people is true? And now you’re claiming that Hamas doesn’t have a tunnel network?
Lemme guess, you’re not an antisemite, you’re an antizionist.
You should read the news. They denied bombing the first hospital and admitted bombing two others. Your argument boils down to “just because they bombed two subsequent hospitals doesn’t mean they bombed the first”. Or is it justified now because the man on the TV said “tunnels”?
Either way your argument is circular and nonsensical
So you ARE claiming Hamas doesn’t have a tunnel network. And pretending Hamas didn’t lie about the hospital bombing.
Just trying to figure out how separated from reality you are. WHY you’re delusional hasn’t been established yet, but it’s probably judenhass. Because for all your pretense not celebrating the deaths of innocents, you’re really standing up for an organization that is explictly dedicated to genocide.
If you criticize Israel you’re an antisemite, but celebrating the death of Palestinian children is somehow what good people do. Truly vile trash
Stop pretending you give a shit about dead children. You’ve made it quite clear you only care about particular children.
People want simple answers.
Correct on both parts: simple and answer. Then they don’t have to go to the trouble of having to think.
We are watching history being made, we could use a new decoder ring though.
ain’t nobody got time too read in times of crisis.
they sound worthwhile reads tbf but not something i would be in the mood right now
Hamas – I cannot feel sympathy for sharia peddling authoritarians.
They don’t care about your sympathy, just your obedience.
intermediate phase they do want useful idiots in the west feeling sympathy
I have a teammate who used to work in DC and is still in touch with Republican insiders. We have great conversations. In our latest, he says that while there’s an open rift in the Republican party, there’s just as big a rift with the Democrats. The Israel/Hamas thing is just part of it. They have a radical faction that will not compromise, and it’s gotten out of control.
just the moment for libertarians ti swoop in and take power
Libertarians always agree on everything.
I actually believe that.
If you talk to really political Republicans all they do is whine about how much their party and all its divisions sucks.
And if you talk to really political Democrats it’s exactly the same. My Democrats friends believe what’s most problematic for Dems is how much they fight amongst each other about various issues. But Republicans don’t see it much.
I think people forget what politics is really like.
I’ll start believing it when we see some Democrats break lines in votes that matter. One thing I’ll give the Democrat party is that they were always very strong with the whip to keep their voters in line. Of course, having cushy landing jobs lined up for them at lobbyist firms if they get voted out probably helps a lot.
I spent some time with my mom and dad last weekend. Despite being very conservative, they are die-hard Dems. It turns out they get their news from MSNBC. They bitched about the border nonstop. Mrs. TOK had to explain to them the concepts of furries and pronouns. (Which was funny as hell). They had no idea those social issues and mass immigration are official Dem policies. As Scott Adams says, the job of the news is not to inform, but to hide things from people. And now I get it.
If all you watch is MSNBC or CNN, you’d never know about the bad shit happening as a result of Dem policies.
The girlfriend’s family used to have CNN on in their house every time I was over there. Always going in the background…
/members when parents used to say “too much television will rot your mind.”
Pravda!
Correct. And that describes a lot of older people who aren’t going to get on the Internet to find other opinions.
Dems are usually good at keeping everyone in line and in lock step. Their leadership tolerated a lot of crazy shit in order to keep that going. But the crazy shit has gotten out of control, and now they have to deal with a monster of their own making.
It won’t be a libertarian moment, but I see two divided parties beating each other up as a positive thing.
I think when the Dems have a House majority we will find out that Jeffries is no Pelosi, but a lot more like a Ryan or McCarthy.
Me too. At the very least it wipes the smug off democrat faces when it comes to their supposed “party unity.” I am enjoying that.
The battle between the prog/socialist/communist wings of the Democratic party and the less insane other part is ongoing. They hate each other perhaps half as much as they hate Republicans, even if they end up voting mostly in lockstep, and are constantly trying to primary each other.
When will this “division” show up in solid blue one party cities? Will Talib and AOC start facing viable opponents in their primary races?
I think that’s a Republican misperception. They are not really in lock step and don’t have an easy time passing shit either.
And Democrats think this about Republicans.
The Israel/Hamas thing made it a lot more visible. Mainline Dems were saying all the Stand with Israel stuff, while a bunch of their shock troops were rallying in the streets to the contrary, some of whom were saying stuff that shocked some long-time faithful Dems.
Hey, anyone here use or familiar with Square?
https://squareup.com/us/en
Any problems with them? Are they a reasonable company to deal with?
The girlfriend uses it for her salon, the only real complaints I’ve heard were due to outages (as is an issue with any hosted product). If you have any specific questions, reach out, and I can pass them along for you.
I used it for a business selling t-shirts about 8 years ago, and we now use it to sell some of our things for our gym. I think it’s a great product, easy to use, secure, and straight forward.
Thanks!
When will they say, “Enough is enough”? Not in the “Let’s just kill them all” sense, but in the “Fuck it, we’re not going anywhere, and apparently neither are they, so we had better figure something out” sense.
Probably never.
The US solved this problem in the 1800s. Kill all the fighting aged males and put the rest on reservations. Make sure they live in abject poverty for the next 100 years.
If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.
Back in the 90s, after Arafat first accepted then rejected a 2 state peace deal with Israel, I penned a diatribe of similar philosophy.
Back then, folks said that Arafat left the peace conference and realized that the people would turn on him and his entire lineage would be at risk… so he reversed course.
Seeing this, I said that the only sane response from Israel would be to issue an ultimatum to the Palestinians and surrounding Arab nations.
“Here is a copy of the deal Arafat accepted. You have 2 weeks to demonstrate that you will ratify this deal, or we will Annex the west bank, Gaza and the Golan Heights. Once annexed, all non-citizens will be deported. All property will be forfeit. This is your last and only opportunity for a state of Palestine. After 2 weeks, all these lands will become a part of the state of Israel, permanently.”
One way or another, the issue would have been settled.
Back then, folks said that Arafat left the peace conference and realized that the people would turn on him and his entire lineage would be at risk… so he reversed course.
Ah, he studied his Irish history. Michael Collins accepted the peace deal and was killed, by his former comrades in arms (against the Brits).
That won’t work this time. There was no support for the tribes outside of territory the USA controlled. The PA/Hamas has plenty of support well outside of the areas Israel can influence. Those weapons don’t come through the Israel border, Egypt allows it to happen.
Insurgency can be continued indefinitely given outside support and sanctuary.
Golda Mier answered the question of when it will stop.
The Israelis have the capability to completely crush the Gazans, regardless of any support the Gazans receive from Iran or other actors. They simply lack the will to do what’s necessary. At first it seemed like they might be willing to do so this time right after October 7, but now it seems that their resolve is fading.
I was surprised the IDF didn’t tell the politicians they were going to remove Gaza, and if the pols objected, they would be removed as well. Even more surprised there haven’t been small Israeli groups who decided to go in and just start salting the earth. Almost as surprised as when I learned Israel had very strict gun control.
It’s insane. They have their one chance to strike such fear in their enemies that the Muslim world will fear to say the word Israel, and they demonstrate they don’t have the stomach to protect their people.
Weapons don’t matter if there is no one alive to use them.
The Indians were the finest light cavalry force in the world. But had no cannon factories or Gatling guns. Not to mention a huge imbalance in population relative to the white and black U.S. The Israelis may be on the wrong side of the numbers equation, but are equal to or better technologically than their opponents, not to mention the ability to make major cities disappear with the push of a button.
Until the Colt revolver came along, you could make the argument that a Comanche on a horse with a bow and arrow was the best weapon system in America. Lots of white eyes got filled full of arrows while they were trying to reload a musket.
The Comanche Empire pretty much had stopped westward expansion for a long time because no one could beat them. Or even find them most of the time.
A war only ends when one side has had its will to fight completely destroyed. Until that happens, this shit will continue.
When one side’s “will to fight” is entirely funded by outside forces that bear little or no consequence from the fighting, they will likely never lose their will to fight.
See, for example, Ukraine. As long as the purse strings were open in the west and cash and arms flowed freely, they seemed happy to continue. Now the pocketbook looks less secure, and the sugar daddy seems like he might have lost interest. Suddenly, the will to fight is wavering.
That’s silly, utopian thought.
Genocide is more probable than coexistance.
Nuke it from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.
I think it was on one of Dan Carlin’s podcasts where he made the assertion that a big step in civilization was when people figured out that subjugated people were worth more alive than dead. A slave could be sold or used for labor. Before that, when your side lost, everyone got killed. After big time slavery started, losers were spared so they could be sold.
The problem here is that the biggest buyers of slaves in our times are other muslims (especially Arabs). I’m not sure they’d be silly enough to buy a Palestinian when they could get a hard working Philippino or African.
Cool lawsuit over copyright infringement. Most dispassionate explanation by an aggrieved party you are ever likely to see
https://youtu.be/byfWscC87Vg?si=hVdkQbLuSV1rWXGL
That was interesting.
Also his series on building a culvert bunker in his back yard looks cool, as well.
Endless war it is, I guess.
Just don’t expect me to pretend to give a shit about Israeli casualties. No one is innocent. Play on.
All wars come to an end. Even those supporting Hamas may get tired of the endless payouts.
Now that the Netanyahu government no longer supports Hamas hopefully the Palestinians will come around too.
I had no idea you work for NPR.
Sorry, I didn’t realize that the Israeli government is the only one on the face of the earth that consistently acts above board apparently. Not a fair interpretation of what you’ve said I suppose but no worse than the unfounded accusation of Jew hate upthread. I understand that this hits a lot of people hard but don’t let your emotions get the better of you.
Israel is America’s greatest ally. Remember all those wars that they never helped us with?
Also, if you question Israel you are an antisemite, but if you say Palestinian children dying is cool then you are a good person, because propaganda
Only in America:
Yup. American conservative publications are disgusting with their genocidal rhetoric. How does one go from “we don’t belong in Ukraine” to “kill every Palestinian”. It’s jack assed.
At least you’re not even trying to defend your “Netanyahu is the reason Palestinians want to kill Jews” remark.
But you are still trying to move the goalposts from “Netanyahu” to “Israel,” so minus points for dishonesty.
You should acknowledged that you’ve lost the plot if your response to finding out that Israel founded Hamas (for the first time, because let’s be honest) is to say “you want to kill Jews”.
After enough instances, it’s not unfounded.
This is common knowledge in Israel.
For years, Netanyahu propped up Hamas. Now it’s blown up in our face
The premier’s policy of treating the terror group as a partner, at the expense of Abbas and Palestinian statehood, has resulted in wounds that will take Israel years to heal from
Nice try, but the statement wasn’t Bibi supported Hamas, it was “Hamas (and therefore Bibi) is the driving force behind Pali judenhass.
Your strong emotions about Israel prevent you from reading other people’s opinions rationally and charitably.
Dude, I’m using the literal (as in literal) reading of what he wrote.
And before you accuse people of being irrational (I’ll grant you uncharitable)… you know what? I’m not going to finish that. You’re Russian, I get that.
These books look interesting.
Croaking my way through that team meeting was fun /damn lies
Still, I’m better than I was this weekend.
I should have followed that second line with “/statistics”.
Ahh, missed opportunities.
Glad you’re feeling better.