I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
– Thomas Jefferson
With the passage and expansion of Canadaās Medical Assistance In Dying law in recent years, the topics of assisted suicide and euthanasia have been in the forefront of the North American popular consciousness in a way that they have not since the trials and eventual conviction of Dr. Jack Kevorkian in the 1990s. Within that context, I have been somewhat surprised at the strong opposition to medical aid in dying laws from some corners of the libertarian community. While valid concerns have been raised that Canadaās provincial single-payer medical care system may be encouraging the option of medical aid in dying as a first resort for patients with expensive chronic illness in order to reduce costs, I still believe that the peaceful termination of oneās life should be an available option for patients. Wherefore, I will endeavor a defense of what I prefer to name āmedical suicide.ā
To begin with, I would like to define some very important terms in order to make it clear precisely what I am defending, and just as importantly, what I am not. In both a popular and legal context with regard to this topic, different terms may be used to refer to more or less the same thing, or to very different things. āMedical Assistance In Dyingā is the term used in Canada to refer to the legal framework that authorizes two different methods of terminating the life of a patient at the patientās request. One such method is the prescription by a physician or nurse practitioner of a fatal dose of a drug, usually a barbiturate, that the patient then self-administers. This type of termination of life is often referred to as āassisted suicideā or āphysician-assisted suicide.ā Dr. Philip Nitschke and Dr. Fiona Stewart, among others in the āright to dieā community, refer to this type of assisted dying as the āpeaceful pillā in their book and web platform of the same name. This is also the type of medical assistance in dying that was first authorized in the US state of Oregon, and subsequently adopted by Washington State, California, and others. The āThanatronā and āMercitronā devices used by Dr. Kevorkian and the āDeliverance Machineā used by Dr. Nitschke technically meet this definition, as the administration of the drug (or gas) was initiated by the patient interacting with a computer or mechanical switch, although the Thanatron and Deliverance Machine required an IV to be placed by a clinician. The other method of terminating the life of a patient authorized by Canadaās MAID law is the administration of a fatal dose of a drug by the clinician to the patient, rather than by the patient himself. This type of termination of life is often referred to as āeuthanasia,ā and could more accurately be described as āmercy killing.ā
The moral implications of this difference should be obvious. Providing a lethal dose of a drug to someone that they will subsequently administer to themselves involves a lesser degree (or absence) of culpability in their death compared with actually causing their death yourself by administering the drug to them. Despite this stark distinction, the two are often conflated by imprecise language. Hence, for the sake of precision, I prefer to use the term āmedical suicideā when referring to the intentional self-administration by a patient of a lethal drug or substance. This is roughly in keeping with the use of the term āmedical abortionā to refer to an abortion induced by drugs, in distinction to surgical abortion. The Greek roots of the word euthanasia translate directly as āgood death,ā and the term may be used to describe medical suicide, mercy killing, or even palliative sedation, whereby a terminal patient is given drugs to render them unconscious while their body succumbs to death naturally. You can think of medical suicide as a subset of euthanasia. The key word in this construction is āsuicide,ā defined by the American Heritage Dictionary as:
The act or an instance of intentionally killing oneself.
Mercy killing is not suicide. While I do believe that mercy killing can be justified under certain circumstances, the involvement of a third party changes the moral, ethical, and legal calculus. We may posit a defensible justification for voluntary mercy killing from the right to contract and/or the right to free association, but we can derive a justification for suicide, including medical suicide, from the much more tenable right to self-ownership.
The principle of self-ownership is fundamental to liberty, and I am sure it would be an unnecessary waste of time justifying it to this audience. If we guide our public policy and legal ethics from the non-aggression principle, which, as articulated by Murray Rothbard, states that:
No one may threaten or commit violence (āaggressā) against another manās person or property. Violence may be employed only against the man who commits such violence; that is, only defensively against the aggressive violence of another.
then certainly we may, as individuals, question the wisdom of suicide, either generally or circumstantially, and we may even enlist all our powers of persuasion towards discouraging suicide at an individual or social level, but we can not justify using force to prevent it. If we accept that a man has a right to dispose of his life however he sees fit, so long as he does not impede the equal right of another, then we must at least tolerate his liberty to terminate it. (As an aside, in anticipation of an argument regarding the abortion issue, there is an important distinction in that suicide, by definition, and without controversy, involves only the disposition of oneās own life, whereas people of good faith may disagree about when, if ever, an embryo or fetus becomes an interested party to an abortion.)
So having established that self-ownership must necessarily entail the right to commit suicide, the only valid objection that can be raised with specific reference to medical suicide is the involvement of a third party to provide the fatal substance to the suicidal patient. This objection, however, is only valid to the extent that state drug control, requiring that access to drugs be restricted through a physicianās prescription, is valid. Returning to the non-aggression principle, I cannot find any possible justification for drug control by the state. It would certainly be within the scope of the non-aggression principle for a medical practitioner, drug maker, drug retailer, or the insurer for any one of those entities to restrict access to drugs through market mechanisms, but the likelihood of market mechanisms alone creating a total barrier to access a drug or substance, as we have with state drug control schemes, is infinitesimally small. Without the legal necessity of a medical gatekeeper to access fatal drugs, medical suicide would require no more third-party assistance than any other method. A commercial transaction between the suicidal patient and a drug supplier should impose no more legal liability or moral culpability on the drug supplier than a commercial transaction between a gun supplier or razor blade supplier and a suicidal person would impose on the gun supplier or razor blade supplier. Certainly no libertarian jurisprudence would impose liability under those circumstances, absent fraud. The only unique aspect of medical suicide that requires the participation of a medical professional is state drug control. Like most in the liberty movement, I yearn for the days when such state drug control schemes are relegated to their rightful place on the ash heap of history, but until then, allowing willing medical practitioners to provide lethal drugs to their patients is unobjectionable.
That having been said, the non-aggression principle equally protects the right of an unwilling medical practitioner to withhold his participation in any procedure or treatment, including medical suicide, in accordance with the dictates of his conscience. No person, whether provider or patient, should ever be forced or coerced into providing or obtaining any medical procedure. And here we round back to where we started, with Canadaās MAID law. To the extent that patients are being coerced by their physicians to make use of MAID to terminate their lives rather than continue treatment, thatās a travesty of the law and of medical ethics. But we must be careful to be precise with our language. At what point does a physicianās advice to a patient rise to the level of coercion? It may be the honest medical judgment of a physician that his patient would be better served by palliative care, medical suicide, or mercy killing than continuing treatment, and preventing a physician from broaching the subject with his patient could easily veer into the sort of medical censorship that we observed during the height of COVID misinformation hysteria. So long as a patient remains free to heed or not heed the advice of his physician, as the case still seems to be, the responsibility for his decision to make use of MAID still ultimately rests solely with himself. The thought of the state mandating medical suicide or mercy killing is chilling, and calls to mind the 20th century horrors of eugenics, but restricting the liberty of patients and physicians is a poor solution to that as yet unrealized problem. We must be cautious not to oppose one variety of tyranny by exchanging it for another. As the well-worn C. S. Lewis quotation reminds us:
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
It would, of course, be barbaric to coerce a desperate person to kill himself, but it is no less so to withhold access to drugs that can bring about a peaceful death from a truly desperate person, leaving him to face the wretched inevitability of the forces of nature, or end his life by means of one of the gruesome, painful, and traumatizing methods left to him. I will happily stand at the barricades shoulder to shoulder with those whose quarrel is with a state that prescribes premature death as a solution to its fiscal woes, as well as with those whose quarrel is with a state whose benevolence consists in dictating the terms by which a man may die.
I am not opposed. Now I do believe Canada is using it as a tool to get rid of costly citizens. Progressives always dream of eugenics, pre and post.
Personally as I approach death I want to be left in the forest with my gun and sword to provide nutrition for the forest animals after I pass.
Silly RJ! Forest creatures don’t use guns and swords.
Those are to fend off the assholes while I expire. āYou kids get off my future corpse!ā
I thought it was so you could reanimate as a boss monster.
Thanks Pat.
I have no problems with someone seeking out assistance in committing suicide. I don’t trust the government to be involved. And in this day and age, I don’t trust most medical providers.
Succinctly well said. That is where I am too.
Yup. They’re letting me trip over my own dick rather than treating or even real diagnostics. It’s become like a thrice monthly pantomime. They know that I’m fading, I know that I’m fading and yet nothing is attempted. The damage has been long done but they won’t fess up so I drag my ass to the office for my 10 minute grilling and the fucker won’t even look me in the eye. Yeah, MAIDS is a thing up here. I don’t blame people for just giving up.
I wish there was some way for you to get some actual help. It’s heartbreaking reading your updates.
Every time your write about your decline I want to drive to Canada and break you out of there.
Free Festus’s Willy!
Gay
Thanks, Friend. It sucks but what ya gonna do?
Avatar checks out.
LOL
Seconded.
Was expecting
*boom*
Good write up Pat, and I’m not just saying that because I agree with you completely.
First don’t die, they multiply.
OT: Project Veritas’ latest
Pfizer Exposed For Exploring “Mutating” COVID-19 Virus For New Vaccines Via ‘Directed Evolution’
I’ve never been a talkative drunk. I First, and then I’m on my way.
Inb4 they trademark “Intelligent Design”
f/k/a āgain of functionā
I agree with going out on ones own terms if you are capable and mentally able to do so. This is less and less likely once one has gotten closer to the end of life or if they are injured or unconscious. At this point a document similar to a Do Not Resuscitate order would be helpful. Who would administer a EOL order and the hotshot would be very difficult in the US.
This conversation can not be had without mentioning the Hospice system we have in the US, which borders on medical suicide. I don’t think this is a bad thing, as it give progressively more opiates to people in pain and often in the home suggests the dosage as “whatever gives them relief.” I don’t have an issue with this as I had to go through this with my family several times over the past several years. Hospice is one of the most compassionate areas of medical care.
A living will/medical directive expressing wishes for DNR and/or palliative sedation can be useful in the event one becomes incapacitated unexpectedly. As you note, something similar often happens unofficially with a wink and nod in hospice and inpatient EOL situations. However, even fatal doses of morphine and the benzodiazepine drugs commonly used in those environments can leave some residual awareness and unpleasantness for the patient, where palliative/terminal sedation should ideally use a drug to induce total unconsciousness in combination with pain and anxiety medications to ensure the patient is peaceful.
This sounds eerily similar to what I experienced when recently euthanizing my dog.
Health care power of attorney AND living will are my strong recommendation. And this is one area where I can claim expertise.
100% with you on Hospice. My father needed that at the end of his life, and it was a godsend.
Obligatory.
I agree with your analysis Pat. The difficulty is implementing it in the real world. As people age or become cognitively impaired due to a disease, it can get pretty murky whether a person has the requisite mental capacity and/or is free of undue influence to make the decision for themselves. There isn’t a perfect solution and under the current regime or the one you suggest, I’m sure there will be terrible stories of what went wrong. I don’t have a solution.
It’s a hard row to hoe. Some people just want to fade away but others are willing to fight. I didn’t need to read the article that closely because I knew that the author would come to the same agnostic opinion. I’ve been thinking about this for over a year. Who the fuck doesn’t want to be a burden but at the same time is unwilling to miss another sunrise? It is a terrible conundrum. Grasping relatives aside, what is the patient to do? Make their peace with God? What if they don’t believe? What if they do believe and suicide means burning torment forever? It’s not for me to say.
Although it may seem callous, ultimately, in keeping with the Jefferson quote with which I opened, I come down on the side of allowing for the possibility of bad cases in order to maximally preserve the liberty of the individual. We have civil and criminal courts to handle edge cases where there exists ambiguity as to the suicidal person’s intentions and cognizance, and of course, even those are not going to perfectly address every circumstance. Such is the nature of things. Hard cases make bad law and all that. I think overall the benefit exceeds the risk.
I agree. Great think-piece, Pat.
That will incrementally bind liberty, once the lawsuits and charges and precedents get whipped out.
Quite possibly, although the court system leaves a lot more flexibility than legislation, and in a legal environment where it is permissible for physicians to prescribe lethal drugs the bar would be quite high to successfully litigate against the physician or their medical group. Such cases have not proliferated in the states that have legalized medical suicide. I was thinking more of a situation where one family member accuses another of deception or coercion against the suicidal patient and sues for, say, negligence or wrongful death.
Have those cases not happened in states with medically assisted suicide because bad cases don’t happen, or because the state has stripped people who would object of the means to do so?
It’s like saying that there aren’t aggrieved would-be-fathers in the abortion issue because we don’t hear about them. Well, the law says they have no say in the matter.
IANAL, but when I was a resident of Washington State I did vote for the initiative that legalized medical suicide, after a fair bit of research on the language and interpretation of the law. Washington’s law mirrors Oregon’s very closely, and in both states there are (or were at that time, at least) multiple steps involved in availing oneself of legal medical suicide. Among the requirements are at least one verbal and multiple written requests to the prescribing physician, concurrence by a second physician, and a terminal diagnosis. Given those hurdles, and the relatively low rate at which medical suicide is utilized by patients, I suspect there’s few cases where a legitimate legal controversy could reasonably arise. In the more permissive environment that I would favor, I suspect there would be more opportunity for such cases.
I don’t think you are callous and I agree with you.
A couple years ago when I was in the hospital the pain was severe and of course the pain pills were issued on a different schedule than my body. I had a lot of negative thoughts.
Good thought provoking article, Pat
Brings to mind one of my absolute favorite episodes of the TV show Millennium, “Goodbye Charlie”
Tucker Smallwood played the mysterious and elusive Doctor Stephen Kiley (he took the name from one of the physicians on Marcus Welby, MD) and was great.
I have been meaning to watch Millennium since it was still on TV. I was an X-Files nut, but I tried coming into Millennium mid-season and was totally lost. It’s on my NAS. Someday…
Wed Zoom
You’re almost 2 hours late!š
I agree with you far too much.
SP and I had an agreement- if I went into mental decline, she’s take me out for that long ride into the desert. One of the many sad things about her departure is that I have to find someone else with her ability to assess, decide, and (so to speak) execute. Also someone who has her ability to aim and hit targets accurately.
#insert
groomingtraining montage hereI’ve got 99 problems, son, but that seconder MikeS? He aint one.
That’s right. We’re thick as thieves. š¤š»š¤š»
āš»
Get a first, you two.
Two killer comments in one thread. Well done.
šš
Good article, and a needed one.
Sounds like most agree with you on the broad strokes, which is good. Pithy comments criticizing the government when they’re the ones dealing death did sometimes sound like criticism of the idea itself, rather than the execution.
I like the idea of a society where you could do this, but that it is frowned upon and generally not easily available, because it’s considered a bit distasteful.
Safe, legal, and rare.ā¢ļø
But I actually agree.
I think a genuinely free society would be like that in many regards. For example, if I had a daughter, I’d be mortified, as I’m sure many fathers would be, if she became a prostitute or a porn star, but I certainly wouldn’t support any law against those careers. I’ve seen a few close friends and family members destroy their lives with drugs and alcohol, but I don’t support restrictions or prohibition on their sale or manufacture. Loan sharking, hell even payday lending, is sleazy, but leaving poor people without any access to credit isn’t any better, and there’s no role for the state in intervening between a lender and borrower.
Of course, it’s easy to say that social pressure and culture would be sufficient to handle those things. I’ve made that argument myself often in the past, but lately I’ve come to doubt it’s true. Theoretically, a permissive society need not inherently become libertine, but let’s not kid ourselves, that’s the overwhelmingly likely outcome. Despite it, I still favor maximal individual liberty, and its corollary, maximal individual responsibility. You’re not free unless you’re free to be wrong. But be prepared to accept your consequences.
Yeah, not anymore.
If it’s SugarFree it’s Ass Wednesday.
https://archive.ph/8SMVB/46994652f994218f7b8820405376f48ee880ff4c.jpg
NSFW.
https://archive.ph/Hvb7R/e5c894d4e816e0629d3a9134759d2e7a8c11eb0e.jpg
NSFW.
https://archive.ph/m5aLY/28d8a6c120c86a2a7a8f94527c5f43114f3613cb.jpg
NSFW.
https://archive.ph/4Ktrt/01af432d538c9d4c8faada890980faf83c8ece2a.jpg
NSFW.
https://archive.ph/RC5ar/9a24a112c19a86be6152fd2671768b1f0612c0e8.jpg
NSFW.
That pic is really problematic.
She really should have a GFCI outlet that close to a bathtub.
I may be in love.
I was shocked, SHOCKED, to learn that she is a redhead.
Topless woman accused of destroying Jesus statue in Fargo cathedral
I wonder what drugs she was on when she got those tatts.
Probably the same ones as when she vandalized a church
All of them, I suspect.
The giant tattoos were also a surprise.
The shaved eyebrows is a nice touch.
“Is there anybody in there? Just nod if you can hear me. Is there anyone home?”
It really pulls the whole look together.
Cursing truckers on I-10 today and tonight TCM plays “Duel”. Nice
Hereās a sad example of what can happen without a peaceful medical suicide option:
She was terminally ill, they went to Death Valley, he shot her, called to report it, and then capped himself.
https://www.ktnv.com/news/elderly-couple-from-las-vegas-found-dead-in-death-valley-national-park?_amp=true
It is sad but better out there than in some hospital where the staff would have kept them apart in her last hours. Fuck the medical industry’s wholehearted embrace of inhuman “COVID protection” practices over simple human decency.
Note the disclaimer at the bottom, with the implication that choosing to end your life on your terms is only OK if you do it in the state-sanctioned way.
One aspect of readily available MAID that gives me pause is that when survivors / loved ones / strangers who read news see that the MAID decision is praised across the board, then it could pressure on others to choose euthanasia for themselves because society says itās āthe right thing to do.ā
Itās similar to a problem I have when parents choose abortion because scans show that their kid will be handicapped. What about the ones who werenāt aborted? Are they to be considered a burden on society?
How about people who are born healthy but then become paralyzed? Are they to be guilt-tripped into euthanasia because theyāre āno longer productive?
The other objection i have is the inclusion of āmental illnessā as a justification for MAID. Suicide is a rather extreme option on which to base opinions that might change with serotonin re-uptake inhibitors or simply the passage of time.
I recall the ST:TNG episode where counselor Troiās mom falls in love with a human-looking alien. But he is about to turn 60, which requires him to turn himself in for mandatory euthanasia.
Letās not become those guys.
I guess Iām admitting no plans for further patents or to publish papers.
I have no issue with assisted suicide as long as you are not encouraged, or nudged in that direction. Which is the main problem with Canukistan
Mornin peeps.
Good morning, Sean, ‘bodru, Scruuffyy, 4(20), Roat, Plinky, homey, and Stinky!
I’m not yet awake enough to comment coherently on topic. I’m just pleasantly surprised I got any sleep at all last night – when I finally got to work yesterday afternoon (after avoiding the overhyped Snowpocalypse) I got an insatiable craving for a Mountain Dew. THEN I had my usual Atkins Mocha Latte shake several hours later than usual.
I hope I can stay awake all day AND through BattleBots tonight! š³
You have the right to control your own body.
I don’t trust the government or health providers to protect people.
My wife at times would probably do this because of drug resistant depression.
Which causes a conflict in my soul.
š
Exactly
https://news.yahoo.com/woman-allegedly-steals-2-8-220916006.html
“In total, the victim wrote 62 checks — totaling more than $2.8 million — that were deposited into Stergo’s bank accounts, the indictment said.”
I don’t think he even got laid. Sad!
The number of people who will steal from the elderly is astoundingly high.
Iāve run into two situations like that in the past couple of years.
Every year when I do my income tax I’m reminded of that. I’ve been unemployed for 35 years, gimme a break.
Just a tip, that guy who calls you and tells you that youāve won the Publishers Clearing House? Heās not really from the Publishers Clearing House.
/conversations Iāve had this year
At the credit union, we get training every year on how to detect possible elder abuse and other financial fraud. It’s probably the most (maybe the only) useful training we’re required to complete. One of my coworkers is the main point person internally for reporting suspected abuse – so many sad cases, but at least we catch some of them.
I’d say he’s lucky based on her pic.
Need an addendum to Dante’s Inferno. There is a special circle of hell reserved for those who prey on the elderly.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/news/pa-auditor-general-criticizes-bethlehem-northampton-school-districts-for-asking-for-option-to-raise-taxes-school-leaders-say-laws-must-be-changed/ar-AA16Ksio
They admit to playing a shell game to fuck your taxes up.
š
https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/florida-mom-suing-school-board-over-her-only-fans-account
I’m on #teamwhore here.
Want to see pictures of your mom?
I wish people would stop asking me that.
Nice.
Though I need to see more pics before making a final judgement.
More seriously, it sounds like sheās got a decent case. Whatās the criteria for keeping her from volunteering? How many other parents have those guidelines been applied to?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bzIKKbb75s4
š¶š¶
Who wears a cape?
NO CAPES
A cape and nothing else is my go-to ensemble.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/west-virginia-man-admitted-to-striking-woman-and-burning-her-with-a-torch-after-alleged-kidnapping/ar-AA16JKT1
That photo. Yikes!
suh’ fam
whats goody
Mornin’ TC, didn’t see you over in the corner, come on it, cold outside
I read that as āon the cornerā.
No judgement, Tres, you gotta do what you gotta do
Loitering for solicitation is no longer a crime in California.
š¶š¶
TrĆØs Coooool
You don’t have to put on the red light
Those days are over
You don’t have to sell your body to the night
š¶š¶š¶
Morning, Sean and Robo,
Early but got the fire going, a cuppa Folgers, time to contemplate.
But is the promotion of the practice morally sound, particularly by the State?
Iām referring to MAID of course.
Iām reminded of the āsafe, legal, and rareā bullshit from the abortion promoters in the 90ās.
So this story has been going aroundā¦know whatās causing these weird heart issues , clotting, and whatnot weāve been so mysteriously seeing for no reason whatsoever? The answer is obvious, itās eggs:
https://www.planet-today.com/2023/01/scientists-warn-eggs-are-causing.html
So the shortages and high prices are all good and itās just wonderful that two fried eggs at the Waffle House will cost you eight bucks. Also, donāt even bring up that thing that so many people got recently you science denying crazy people.
And some stupid asshole will believe that.
A lot of ‘coulds’ in that article.
The family doc just took me off low dose aspirin. Said I didn’t need it. After 35 years and out living the Doc that initially prescribed it.
I go through a dozen eggs a week. Cheap protein even at the current price.
Been nice knowin’ y’all.
.
I love eggs myself, three of them over medium fried in olive oil and sop up the yoke with some toast is better than an expensive steak.
Iām good for 3 a day, sometimes 4, every day. My wife is good for 2. Two 18-packs a week has gotten spendy.
*looks at steak budget*
$0.35 remaining
You might need to adapt.
*Adds eggs to growing list that includes: cold showers, too much TV, falling asleep to TV, gardening, energy bills, etc.
The snow drought continues but I-95 doesn’t need it.
I can’t blame it all on our local drivers. I normally see many out of state plates on I-95.
Mornin’, reprobates!
Good morning, ‘patzie!
Yo, GT. Morning Musica con Cafe.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s1pBDBYVyrU
Cool! If that doesn’t get you chair-dancing, check your pulse! šš¶
Mornin’
How’s that software adaptation going?
Transgender person with an ax attacks two people in a quick shop:
https://twitter.com/FightHaven/status/1618247335091240961?cxt=HHwWgoCw7ZPYlfUsAAAA
Pretty bizarreā¦
They were defending themselves against the violence inherent in the system.
“A drugged up Transgender Woman splits a man’s head in half with a Battle Axe at 7-Eleven…”
This elder abuse has got to stop.
In Australia, even the femboys want to kill you!
Morning, Glibs.
Evidently I overslept, so I connected to work first. What are you lot up to?
Loading a software adaptation. Morning.
I am up to no good, as usual. Enjoying this balmy winter; I ā¤ climate change.
Good morning, U! I’m trying to put together a Duluth Trading order that’s just enough to get the free shipping.
It’s a trap.
Trying to get the rest of the family out of the house so I can have some peace.
Using a cat-herding broom?
Team India is on vacation. So I can sit here and drink coffee. Itās nice.
I am pretty sure Zelle has blacklisted me or my bank account. Bank said there was some weird condition code attached to my Zelle and they didn’t know what it was. I can receive money, but cannot use it to send money. Zelle themselves claim its a bank problem.
Who is Zelle?
“some weird condition code attached to my Zelle”
Euphemism?
Wait, donāt bury the lede -people actually use Zelle?
My landlord started offering it but Zelle won’t take my money because the rent is too damn high.
Back when I paid rent and even now with my mortgage I am content to have scheduled online bill pay cut them a check and mail it to them
Banks do that? I could check that out.
It’s great. Really.
Except my landlord expects me to use the envelope and remittance thingie they provide.
My HOA provides those but takes my bank issued checks. As a bonus, online checking doesn’t cost anything for the check or postage.
Yup.
āYou want my money? Cash the check. Donāt cash the check, fine by me, but then donāt be crying you werenāt paid.ā